HELP: Sack coat size alterations...

[WoodenNutmeg]

I have an entirely hand sewn Federal fatigue coat that currently needs alterations. I love this coat and would hate to part with it, so it is my hope and intention to make it fit properly. I am a size 36 and the jacket right now is closer to a 40 in size. Seemingly, alterations to the sleeves, collar, etc, are going to be more difficult being that the coat is fully assembled, so if someone could guide me with details of instruction (patterns, pictures, and the like) I would appreciate it.

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[BrianHicks]

Just a thought... but why alter it?

Fatigue Blouses were not made to be tailor fit. They were often issued in bulk, and getting a correct fit wasn't a sure thing. Having a Federal Issue uniform item (especially a Sack Coat and Trousers) that is not the correct size might not have been that unusual. (Especially considering how many soldiers wrote so often about how they lost weight after enlisting.....)

[PanzerJager]

I would think if you want that “true” government issue look you would just take the coat “as is” and wear it big, there are literally hundreds of photos that show this, just go through any number of period photos and it won’t take long to spot coats that are to big for the frame of the man wearing it. What you are talking about in regards to alterations is not simply rolling up sleeves that are to long or moving buttons over for more/less room but full disassembling the coat, if that’s the case your best bet would be to start from scratch. If you are still growing the day may come when you want a larger size down the road.

Regards,

[WoodenNutmeg]

Fatigue Blouses were not made to be tailor fit. They were often issued in bulk, and getting a correct fit wasn't a sure thing. Having a Federal Issue uniform item (especially a Sack Coat and Trousers) that is not the correct size might not have been that unusual.

I certainly agree, however, it is far more ample to me, personally, to seek an alteration in size. Currently, the jacket is stamped a size 3 and it just drapes on me. I understand that while this was common among soldiers, it is not far fetched that a Federal soldier in his day could just as easily have found a size 1 or 2, either.

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[WoodenNutmeg]

If you are still growing the day may come when you want a larger size down the road.

Well, I'm done doing that, that's for sure.

What you are talking about in regards to alterations is not simply rolling up sleeves that are to long or moving buttons over for more/less room but full disassembling the coat, if that’s the case your best bet would be to start from scratch.

That's my fear. Is my best bet then to simply sell the piece and attempt to get a proper fitting one?

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[Curt-Heinrich Schmidt]

Hallo!

IMHO, there is a difference between making a few "field alterations"' and what might amount to the complete disassembly of the blouse, the pieces parts being recut down from "Size 40" to "Size 36," and the blouse reassembled. (Warning: sometimes pattern pieces do not always allow such downsizing...)

As shared, the CW "model" was issuance without regard to size- requiring clothing to be worn as is, personally or "professionally" altered, or traded for a more appropriate size.

IMHO, since the blouse is two sizes too big, I would leave it be. (For many years, I went with a "frumpy" Federal look and ordered my unfirom items two sizes too big on purpose...

And last but not least, and NOT something I would urge or recommend for the potential damage or ruination it may cause (due to possible pieced warp-weft alignment issues, etc, etc.) ... but a soaking in hot water followed by a spin in the dryer would shrink the blouse more than a few sizes... :rolleyes:

Curt
Who just shrunk a "Size 44" jacket down to "Size 42" Mess

[ohpkirk]

Hallo!

(Warning: sometimes pattern pieces do not always allow such downsizing...)



Which pattern pieces might you be typing about that can not be downsized? Even if the individual is not familiar with a period drafting manual (Devere's, et al.) simple mathematics would allow them to move the seam and thus make a smaller size. For example, with the fatigue blouse there are four pattern pieces for the body. To make the sz. 40 blouse into a sz. 36, the individual would simple move the seam inward 1/2 inch. They would then restitch the garment using the old line of stitching as a guide if they choose to resize it completely.

[Erik]

Perhaps this is a modern desire for fit as opposed to what actually happened.
If you are a recruit, just off mother's dumplings lovingly served, Camp life would slim you down by activity. The issue ration, though enough, would not fatten you up. That size 40 coat drawn when you were a chubby boy fresh from home would hang like a curtain soon enough.
If during service you were issued a new one, you would not be guaranteed a Brooks Brother's fit.
Feel uncomfortable? Visit the unit tailor and have him tuck in the excess or have your comrades blouse in the back under your belt.
Being of slim stature I often had to deal with standard sizes during my service time and generally made it look good. It is what you would do.
I recently purhased an Officer's Sack coat from C. J. Daley. I enjoy wearing it for its cut and quality. It hangs like a curtain on my frame. That is what it is supposed to do. It is a sack coat not an elegantly tailored frock.
Too many times we see abundantley filled sack coats, a result of our North American plenty, straining at the buttons. You should be proud of you slimmness and ill fitting jacket. Trust me it will fit soon enough.
If you would look elegant instead of workmanlike, buy a good frock and save your sack for the field.

Erik Simundson
4th Michigan, Co. C

[coastaltrash]

Erik,
The cut, assembly and fit of a private purchase sack coat should be relatively different that a sack coat, since they were specifically made for the individual.

MANY pictures exist of original sack coats fitting horribly as well as enlisted frocks.

[benjaminmcgee]

Hello,

My wife machine washed my sack coat and machine dryed it to boot. I guess it was a little ripe. I did indeed shrink it a size or two. After I burned off the wool fuzz with a bic,it looked awesome, a bit like a coat that was boiled to kill lice. I'm not encouraging peolple to do this, just trying to get my post #'s up:wink_smil

Benjamin McGee

[PanzerJager]

Well, I'm done doing that, that's for sure.

That's my fear. Is my best bet then to simply sell the piece and attempt to get a proper fitting one?

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

Personally I will echo the other posts and say screw it, wear it as is, that’s classic government issue at it’s finest. Unless you are familiar with assembling garments and the process of downsizing and sewing techniques briefly mentioned by Cody your best bet may be to get a new coat if you can not make yourself happy with the current fit. What Cody mentioned is not a hard technique necessarily, just time consuming and you will need sewing skills or know someone who does to reassemble the coat.

Regards,

[csabugler]

I am a damn fine plumber but only an average tailor. I have built 4 different style coats, with and without patterns. They all reflect my level of skill. Mrs. lawson can attest to that. I have also made pants, shirts, mex-war packs, haversacks, vests, even a saddle. But with that experience I would not attempt to make a major reduction to a valued piece for fear that it would come out worse than it began, and no longer be so valued.

[ohpkirk]

As others have pointed out, there is nothing wrong with wearing a garment too large or too small. I was merely asking Curt which pattern pieces might be difficult to downsize as mentioned in his post.

I'm a sz 42 chest and I've worn a sz. 40 blouse tucked in as the Calvaryman in the CS EOG section showing Dept. of the Trans-Mississippi clothing (the man wearing a carbine on a sling, etc.) I've made pants a size too large, as well. As other poster's have pointed out: clothing was issued to, not tailored for the individual soldiers.

[Secesh]

Hello,
Personally, I wear a 40 but purposely order and wear a size 42 to give it that issued look. Best regards.

[Curt-Heinrich Schmidt]

Hallo!

"I was merely asking Curt which pattern pieces might be difficult to downsize as mentioned in his post."

I am not a tailor or craftsperson, and do not have a set of fatigue blouse patterns on hand to compare and contrast, but I was recalling a negative experience of mine where larger sized armsythes would not accomodate the smaller sized sleeves.

Perhaps someone with knowledge and skills can chime in.

But I will post an image nonetheless.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y104/Michael1787/CivilWaruniformlargefit.jpg

Curt

[Shockoe Hill Cats]

Just a thought... but why alter it?



Mr. Hicks is right, I have the same size problemo you have here. I just wear it a bit big myself! :rolleyes:

And as Mr. Curt showed, countless photographs exemplify this common situation.

[nick19thind]

Couldn't you trade coats with a friend?

[WoodenNutmeg]

[...]I would not attempt to make a major reduction to a valued piece for fear that it would come out worse than it began, and no longer be so valued.

Thank you, Patrick...I have been debating over whether or not to adopt this logic.

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[WoodenNutmeg]

Great picture, Curt!

I am well aware of the sizing of garments during the war, but I also know that there is nothing wrong with wanting a garment to fit close, if not closer. This fact, in contrast to Curt's photo, can also be evidenced...

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb249/digthefuzz/sackcoat.jpg

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[WoodenNutmeg]

Couldn't you trade coats with a friend?

Afraid not, Nick.

This jacket is one-of-a-kind and no trade would suffice.

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[Curt-Heinrich Schmidt]

Hallo!

And swinging the pendulum a little further in that direction... ;) :)

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y104/Michael1787/CivilWaruniformtight-1.jpg

Curt

[WoodenNutmeg]

Haha, yes indeed.

Bryan O'Keefe, Esquire

[csabugler]

Hey Curt, that looks like me after the holidays....
regarding that sizing job, as a master plumber, I do things effortlessly that someone skilled in another trade would not even attempt. And vice/versa. A tailor might consider that job as rudimentory. But if you aren't sure of exactly what you will need to do to make this work, don't try.

[prestontoprail]

I'll just add a quick quirp of advice to stick with the 4 common issue sizes for the fatigue blouse.
Size 1:36
size 2:38
size 3:40
size 4:42

If I normally wore a 42, then I wouldn't trying upgrading to a 44 considering a size 44 jacket would be harder to find than a 42 if your going for that "issue" look. From many accounts I have read it seemed that plenty of times the blouses would be in a big pile and one by one the recruit would walk up, the nco would give the guy a look and throw a jacket at him. It seemed to be up to the men after issues to get together and trade for sizes.

Another thing to consider is that the jackets were made with the size 1 and 2 jackets in the majority. Most fellas in those days were short and skinny as a rail as we know. I usually wear size 1 uniforms, because it is so UNDER-represented these days considering most of us are of a modern build. So it seems that if you were a larger fella, then a tight jacket of issue size would fit the period situation. To the original poster, I would order a size 1 fatigue blouse down the road and consider your current size 40 jacket an alternate.

[Erik]

The intent of my post was not to highlight the advantage of a private purchase sack coat. I simply was trying to say that you wore what you were issued. As an officer if you ordered a sack from your tailor they would produce it from your last measurements. Reality suggests that if you lost weight on campaign it would hang.
When dealing with issued items there would be a greater degree of size variances. I have endured the exact same thing. My size has dropped since I ordered my sack and I am fitter as a result. Would I send it back because it does not fit like a glove? No.
If one desires a glove like fit then they should go to a custom tailor or accept the standard sizes. If you buy off the internet or sutler's row then live with it or...
make wiser choices.

Erik Simundson