Old King Crow in the Trans Miss.

[Old Cremona]

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Kyle Pretzl on the bones. This kid can really play!!

[Thomas Alleman]

I met the man who sang that very song in the Ride with the Devil movie and he did serenade us with it. That was the best thing about the 140th Antietam. I am glad that others have picked up that minstrels tune.

[sepoy1857]

Thanks Carl!

Another great song.

[pvt_jb]

All I could do was smile and tap my foot!

Thanks for posting!!!

[mslaird]

Thanks for posting that one Carl. The family got a real kick out of it.

[Kiev Thomason]

Yeah that boy can throw down on dem bones.I really think that when we were playing around the fire was the highlight of my trip to Pea Ridge.I have been playing the bones for two years and he is way better!
Thanks for posting this Carl and good to hang out with you at the event....enjoy the shirt!

[Old Cremona]

Yeah that boy can throw down on dem bones.I really think that when we were playing around the fire was the highlight of my trip to Pea Ridge.I have been playing the bones for two years and he is way better!
Thanks for posting this Carl and good to hang out with you at the event....enjoy the shirt!

Kiev, it was a treat meeting you. I was gonna make a buddy of mine buy this overshirt 'cause he needs to improve, but I might not be able to let it go :wink_smil

Man, kids just learn so fast it's amazing. Kyle wants to learn banjo next, and he'll probably be kicking my butt before long.:cry_smile

[Spinster]

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I do believe this clip showcases the aformentioned up and coming young bonesman even more. What a pleasure!! Thank y'all for making them available.

[OldKingCrow]

Old King Crow was/is Virginia Minstrel tune and not a published well founded standard with national exposure.

How did such a tune make its way to the TM ?

From an accuracy standpoint is this akin to a TMD soldier wearing an RD ?

Mind you this is discussion and not a cheap shot at these lads who are are doing a fine job. Please know that.

OKC

Caw, Caw, Caw

[Hank Trent]

Old King Crow was/is Virginia Minstrel tune and not a published well founded standard with national exposure.

How did such a tune make its way to the TM ?


Well, it was at least published as sheet music in 1847 "as sung by the Virginia Minstrels"
http://hdl.loc.gov/loc.music/sm1847.420800

Eastern minstrel performances were hitting California at least as early as 1848. History of California by Hubert Howe at http://books.google.com/books?id=UOoNAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA243 reports in 1847 "some of the New York volunteers gave minstrel entertainments at Santa Barbara and Monterey," and "The Virginia minstrels played with success during the winter, Star and Cal., Dec. 9, 1848."

I don't know if it was the actual Virginia minstrels, but with a name like that it's clear where they were getting their inspiration. I believe George Christy's Minstrels played in California in 1858. So there was a fair amount of cultural sharing coast-to-coast. I don't think it wouldn't be surprising to hear some of the same minstrel songs in the west as well as the east.

Hank Trent
hanktrent@voyager.net

[OldKingCrow]

Doh !!! I should have LOC'd before posting....I had docsouth searched it to no avail.

Excellent work. My question stems from discussions last month with Marty Liebschner (Banjoist in the devil rides movie) when I asked the similar question regarding regional minstrel tunes widely known across the CS armies. Seemingly the minstrel tunes are localized/sectional in nature we concluded they would not be as known as say a standard such as Lorena, Katie Wells, etc.....

Would say an AOT soldier neccessarily know the tunes Sweeney was pick'n out for Ole' Beauty to croon along to.

Thanks.

[Hardtack Herring]

Thasa great! I sees de young massah is cooking up de ho cake by de fir whiles yous boys sings de tune. My belly be hongry for de ho cake!

[Danny]

...regarding regional minstrel tunes widely known across the CS armies. Seemingly the minstrel tunes are localized/sectional in nature we concluded they would not be as known as say a standard such as Lorena, Katie Wells, etc...

It's quite clear from period literature that Minstrel music performances and the sheet music made popular from those were in no way "regional", in fact definitely the opposite. They were a significant cultural export, not only from the Northeast to the South, but to England and the continent, and as far as the Sandwich Islands (Hawaii etc) and Australia as well, and not uncommonly, and within months of the first stateside perfomances and publishing.

It is generally agreed by historians that Minstrelry was one of the first expressions of "pop" (popular) music the world had ever experienced, in part because of the telegraph and the many newspapers read by the first sizeable populations of literate people, but also because it was highly interesting and "exotic".

To follow the money alone tells the story, and there were many bunches of money made selling individual sheet music, collections, and tutors, including Old King Crow and others, a practice that would have quickly collapsed except for their being available everywhere, if only through the mails. Minstrel shows and sales of printed Minstrel tunes continued throughout the CW, including in the South.

Dan Wykes

[tater_cuffie]

hey thanks yall but the bones don't only make up the song lol it''s the whole band, cause without the other fellers playin all the other instryuments the sond wouldn't be the same

-Kyle Pretzl

[Old Cremona]

Old King Crow was/is Virginia Minstrel tune and not a published well founded standard with national exposure.

How did such a tune make its way to the TM ?


It's quite simple, really. Old King Crow was published, in standard notation, in the seminal Briggs Banjo Instructor.Not only does this excellent method book give us early banjo repertiore, but it gives us the style that was in popular usage at the time. It is the Briggs version that I'm playing.

[Tarheel]

Carl,
Absolutely wonderful!!!!! Do you think you could persuade young master Pretzl to join us next March when we go "Into The Piney Woods"??? The two of you would make the event even more special. Please, I beg of you, keep the music coming. It brings everything just that much closer for those of us on the far side of the Atlantic.
Many thanks,
Patrick Reardon,
The Lazy Jack Mess, UK

[OldKingCrow]

Mr Anderton...

Thanks for squaring me away on that. I acquired a period banjo that after some restoration..turned out pretty nice. It really rings out with the new natural head..though I have no exp with using it in the elements.

I will get a copy of Brigg's asap..for certain sure. I have been pick'n out tunes from Marty's Play Dat Banjar and Forgotten Times Forgotten Music but being a manic neurotic accuracy hound I was worried that being so Virginny in nature I would farb it up playing them in the deep South or too far removed from the Ol' Dominion.

Being a long time guitar picker I really enjoy a new approach and my new 5 string friend.

Great work keep it up.

[Old Cremona]

Carl,
Absolutely wonderful!!!!! Do you think you could persuade young master Pretzl to join us next March when we go "Into The Piney Woods"??? The two of you would make the event even more special. Please, I beg of you, keep the music coming. It brings everything just that much closer for those of us on the far side of the Atlantic.
Many thanks,
Patrick Reardon,
The Lazy Jack Mess, UK

Patrick,

You are very kind. I'm sure that L'Infant terrible would love attending an event the quality of IPW. Your kind entreaties make it hard to resist.

[Old Cremona]

Mr Anderton...

Thanks for squaring me away on that. I acquired a period banjo that after some restoration..turned out pretty nice. It really rings out with the new natural head..though I have no exp with using it in the elements.

I will get a copy of Brigg's asap..for certain sure. I have been pick'n out tunes from Marty's Play Dat Banjar and Forgotten Times Forgotten Music but being a manic neurotic accuracy hound I was worried that being so Virginny in nature I would farb it up playing them in the deep South or too far removed from the Ol' Dominion.

Being a long time guitar picker I really enjoy a new approach and a new friend.

Great work keep it up.

Christopher,

Sounds like you're serious about learning early banjo music. If I can be of any help please don't hesitate to ask. Are you aware of the Early Banjo Gathering that George Wunderlich puts on at the Pry House barn in early September? It's the place to be for minstrel banjo enthusiasts.

I met Marty a few years ago at Franklin. He's a super nice guy. I would hesitate forming your style around his method books, though. Like the research standards we have for everything else in this hobby, authentic music should be based on primary source materials. The Briggs tutor, as well as the Phil Rice method of 1858 and James Buckley's New Banjo Book from 1860 has enough material to keep anyone busy for a good long time.

[Silas]

Carl, what's the first song on that clip provided by Mrs. Lawson? I recognize Grapevine Twist as the second song of the second video posted here. I don't recognize the first.

Oh, yeah. That boy really shakes dem bones. As a birthday present from Mrs. Silas, I got a new pair ob bone bones.

[Old Cremona]

Carl, what's the first song on that clip.

Briggs Breakdown.

[Anna Allen]

Awesome!! I love the new videos. And nice beard, Frank. If you're reading this Frank, I hope you keep it for this weekend. Unless your wife already made you shave.

Carl, I recognize that red shawl you're wearing around your neck. :) Glad you could put it to some use. Heard you guys FROZE out there. Can't wait to see the gang next month!

[Old Cremona]

Can't wait to see the gang next month!

I've got a George Wunderlich banjo all set up for you to practice on at the Boone Village, Anna.