Question about Enfield slings

[RangerSWB]

According to a reputable sutler, Enfield rifle slings from England were supplied in black, russet or oiled/natural leather color. RFI: What leather finish was the most commonly supplied? And were all (or most) straps marked Issacs Campbell & Co.?

I've done some searching on this site and others, and I can't come up with any conclusive answers...My apologies if this has been covered before. I'm new to the hobby and would appreciate any feedback. Thanks in advance.

George Walters

[Yellowhammer]

George,

First, I am unfamiliar with any gun slings of any kind being finished "russet." Russet is a reddish brown treatment and the term is frequently misused by reenactors. The color "russet" can vary in color to modern "cordovan" to the brownish red tops of riding boots.

British gun slings I have seen include oiled and blackened harness leather and blackened or white buff. However, I have no data as to which of these was more prominent among the imported gun slings.

Regarding the Isaacs and Campbell marking, of the millions of Enfields imported during the war, only a tiny fraction would have been so marked. Most English accoutrements imported by the Confederacy (excepting knapsacks) are unmarked and of course, none of English leather goods imported by the Union Army would carry the I&C markings.

[Enfield]

George,

Frankly, of the sutler-supplied "Enfield" slings I have seen, NONE comes very close to the mark, based on originals. Original Enfield slings made in England were either black bridle leather, rough side out, and waxed (the smooth inner surface was oiled, or sometimes also dyed black), or white buff leather. I have never seen an original that was russet or plain oiled leather. By far the most common was the black leather style. As with other imported British accoutrements, those bought by CS (and a few US) purchasers were the styles most commonly found in the British industry that was already supplying these to the Volunteer movement in England, and these were overwhelmingly the black leather styles used by the Rifle units in the British army. The white buff leather styles were for British line infantry. Since the Volunteers were mostly Rifle units (which was a lot "cooler" than a regular old line infantry grunt ;) , they had the black leather accoutrements.

The common Rifle-style black leather sling had one standing and one sliding loop, and either a plain brass buckle (not a roller buckle) or a thong tie at the triggerguard swivel end. The leather used was noticeably thicker and stiffer than a US-style sling. I have not seen an original British sling of this period with rivets, although I have seen a couple slings that are supposedly Southern copies of the Enfield sling, that did have rivets.

Anyway, I have only ever seen one sutler Enfield sling that was a really good repro (the maker borrowed one of my originals as the model), and it's not on the market anymore (it was Tom Czekanski, and AFAIK, he's not producing now). The rest varied from *getting there* to absolutely awful.

Among the latter is a plain oiled leather sling, with an Isaacs Campbell marking that is completely bogus. If people are going to put markings like that on Enfield accoutrements (and I'd advise against it myself - the majority of originals show no maker/supplier marks), they ought to try to make it look like the original marking. They ought to AT LEAST get the address right, and do the name the same way IC did on their known markings.

OK, having said all this, of course, there probably ARE originals out there somewhere that are somehow russet or plain leather. There seems to be no all-or-none "rules" when it comes to period British military products. But by far the most common would be the black leather (rough side out) sling.

Hope this helps ... sorry I can't recommend a current maker.

Geoff Walden

[MuleyGil]

Many moons ago, a white canvas sling w/ a sewn on leather reenforcing strip was considered the Enfield sling. Was it based on ANY WBTS sling or was it a military sling at all?

Just wondering.

Gil Tercenio

[Kevin O'Beirne]

Geoff,

How common was it for the Federal government to purchase British-made slings with Enfields issued to the Federal army?

[VMI88]

Many moons ago, a white canvas sling w/ a sewn on leather reenforcing strip was considered the Enfield sling. Was it based on ANY WBTS sling or was it a military sling at all?

Gil,

What you describe sounds like a Confederate-made sling: check out an original on The Haversack Depot's website at http://www.haversackdepot.com/newitems.htm#sling. (This particular sling is made for a Springfield, but an Enfield sling would be very similar, just longer.)

[major]

Here is my attempt to make a correct leather sling for the British Enfield.
Terry
http://www.9thnycavalry.webeditor.com/pictures_for_web/british_sling.jpg

[Enfield]

Kevin,

I doubt it was common at all. British-made slings show up in period Federal images only rarely. The exception would be those Mass. regiments (like the 44th) that were armed and equipped with Enfields and British accoutrements. But I reckon this was only early in the war.

Geoff Walden

Geoff,

How common was it for the Federal government to purchase British-made slings with Enfields issued to the Federal army?

[Enfield]

Terry,

That's the correct style of the most common British-made sling of the period - the Rifle-style that I was talking about. On the originals I have seen, the rough part was heavily waxed until almost smooth, and the edges were also waxed and smoothed (with an edger, or edge wheel). Also, the tip with the thong had each corner clipped off slightly - makes it easier to go through the sling swivel.

I posted some incorrect wording in an earlier post - All these slings had a running loop and the thong tie at the bottom (as on Terry's version). The common style had a standing loop at the other end (again like on Terry's), while some had a plain brass buckle for adjustment.

Installing these slings is different from a US-style sling. For one thing, an Enfield sling of the proper dimensions will be a VERY tight fit in repro sling swivels, because the repro swivels are a little smaller than originals. Start at the upper sling swivel, and thread the thong end through the swivel from the stock side out (ie, hold the upper swivel straight out, and thread the thong end of the sling up through from below, with the smooth side of the leather facing out away from the musket). Make sure the running loop is down by the standing loop. Then run the sling back down around the upper swivel, through the running loop then the standing loop, toward the lower sling swivel. Pass the end through the lower swivel from the triggerguard side toward the stock (back up toward the upper swivel). Thread the thong ends through the holes and tie tightly (most originals have the left-over leather of the thongs cut off). Adjust for desired length, and push the running loop up against the upper swivel. (This is a lot easier to do, than to describe in words!) When finished, the rough (black) side will be facing out and the standing loop will be up near the upper swivel (not like on a Springfield sling, with the standing loop at the lower swivel).

Geoff Walden



[QUOTE=major]Here is my attempt to make a correct leather sling for the British Enfield.
Terry

[ScottFugate]

Geoff,

I have been wanting to make a copy of an "English" sling for some time now. About what would the overall length of the sling be? Or asked another way, how close would the ends be to each other when installed on the rifle and tightened up all the way? Nearly touching?

Thanks for all the good info.

Scott Fugate
WIG

[hardtack1864]

Okay, since we know that british gear was used rarely with federals, what type of strap should we use with are enfields, because a Springfield strap is to small, but a enfield strap is not PEC. So what type of sling should we use then, apart from not having a strap?

[major]

Scott
The over all length of my sling from tip to tip is 49 inches. If you want one e-mail me and I can get you one. t.schultz5@verizon.net
Terry

[Minieball577]

First, I am unfamiliar with any gun slings of any kind being finished "russet." Russet is a reddish brown treatment and the term is frequently misused by reenactors. The color "russet" can vary in color to modern "cordovan" to the brownish red tops of riding boots.

The 1862 U.S Ordnance manual lists gun slings as being "russet" (p.228?). Is this different than what is being refered to here?

[Will Rumsey]

I got a question if anyone can help. I just recieved my Enfield sling from Orchrd Hill and they say that the rough side or Russet colored side faces out and the black side or smooth side faces in towards your shoulder.I got some pards that say it should be black side out.Did they make these slings in two different styles or have I made a mistake.Thanks,

[Clark Badgett]

Geoff, I was reading the history of the 6th KY US, and in it the author stated that they recieved their Enfields while in camp near Bardstown, one of the companies traded in their revolving Colt rifles for them. At this point in the war, late '61 to early '62, what would the chances be that those newly arrived muskets actually had the English slings with them. Didn't the slings normally come with the musket along with all the other trinkets, or was that mainly a CS thing.

ps, did I tell you that I've got a decent picture here of a member of the 9th KY US and he is holding what seems to be a blued Enfield?

Also would you happen to have the address of the Color Case Company in Cincinnati?

[Clark Badgett]

Will, simply dye it black on the rough side, and if you can rub it with a light coat of store bought lard, really work it in well. Don't you think for a minute that waxed leather actually had wax on it, it was Sperm Oil. Attach the sling with the blackened rough side out. And no the outside should not commonly be brown.

[Will Rumsey]

Sounds good .I will give her a try.Thanks .Oh yea what type of dye should I use? I know black but is there a period type I can make or is that something I can bye from the store.What would it be? Thanks again.

[Clark Badgett]

Well, it is best to use a good period recipe for any dye that you plan on using. Period dyes really do look a lot different, especially after they age a little. Here is the black dye from the Ordnance manual. You can scale it down to fit however much you need.

Dye for Blacking Belts.

Extract of logwood 2 lbs
Broken nutgalls .5 lbs
Pyrolignate of iron .5 pint
Soft water 1 gallon

The logwood and nutgalls are boiled in the water till the logwood is dissolved. When cold, add the pyrolignate of iron. Stir it well and let it-settle. When clear, decant it free from sediment and keep it well corked.
The pyrolignate of iron made by dissolving iron-filings in pyroligneous acid,-as much as the acid will take up.
The addition of the logwood is not essential.
A solution of copperas may replace the pyrolignite of iron, but it is not so good.

The Pyrolignate of iron can be made by disolving steelwool in cider vinegar. Nutgalls are the ugly deformations found on oak branches. Got one in my back yard with many on it.

[Clark Badgett]

Thanks for the formula. This is the first time I've ever come across a formula that used wax. Have seen a few that called for sperm oil. I can personally vouch that the formula that I posted for black dye, I've used it, had 2 sets of accoutrements made with it and it's black, very black. I do agree about the English stuff, as both my original pieces are just the way you described for the most part, and this is 140 years after they were made.

[RangerSWB]

Thanks to everyone for all the good information. However, two questions remain. The sutler who offers the sling as "with the smooth finished side facing inward towards your shoulder, meaning that the smooth side rides on your shoulder while the rough side faces out" appears to have the finishes backwards. Is this assumption correct or am I just misreading it?

Also, if the rough side was "waxed" with any of the recipes offered here, wouldn't the sling leave a stain on clothing unless it was "cured" in some way? Thanks again in advance.

George Walters

[Jake Hill]

One question comes to mind about the slings. Would it be appropriate not to even have a sling at all? I used to have one and it was horrible (farby) and it always got entangled in the rest of my gear. So it is now discarded. If this is an ignorant question I am truly sorry.
Thank You

[Clark Badgett]

George, stains make uniforms look right, as does dirt and grime.

Jacob, yes, no sling is a good option, many photos show slingless muskets.

[Richmond Depot]

In the latest copy of the Watchdog ( Summer 2004 ) there is an interesting article that essentially blasts the thong type of sling ( indicated elsewhere in this thread as being correct)as being incorrect and actually for the 1903-1904 Lee Enfield. Any thoughts from the Enfield Experts out there? Or better yet,anyone know of any original photo's of them in use by US or CS troops?

[SCSecesh]

I believe a colleague of mine may be able shed some light on this as he has recently seen a few English import items. My direct question to him regarded the "thong" Enfield sling I bought from TMD. His reply was that my sling mimiced the original he had the pleasure of observing. Neill, any more insight??


In the latest copy of the Watchdog ( Summer 2004 ) there is an interesting article that essentially blasts the thong type of sling ( indicated elsewhere in this thread as being correct)as being incorrect and actually for the 1903-1904 Lee Enfield. Any thoughts from the Enfield Experts out there? Or better yet,anyone know of any original photo's of them in use by US or CS troops?

[1stMaine]

Comrades,

This is the body of text I posted in another thread, with a couple of additions regarding the sling dimensions, etc.

Comrades,

Issue No. 4, Vol. X May-June 1983 of the North South Trader has an excellent article on English accouterments imported by Massachusetts. The article has several images accompanying it, and there are some of the 44th and 6th Mass. regiments where English-pattern slings with "D" buckles are plainly visible on the Enfield.
Of interest as well is the facsimile of Plate 15 of Captain Martin Petrie's contemporary book "Equipment of Infantry" which depicts the accouterments and weapons of the Rifles, Guards, and Line regiments of 1865.
The illustration shows the two patterns of bayonet frogs, one with a belt and buckle to secure the scabbard, and the other sans belt. The plain one is labeled as "buff" while the belted one is clearly labeled as "black leather'. The same with the waistbelt. The belt with the snake buckle is clearly labeled as black leather, whereas the buff belt uses a spoon and wreath buckle. Likewise, the cartridge box belt as well as the rifle slings are divided into buff and black leather, with the rifle-musket sling using the "D" buckle being black, and listed at 1 &1/8" wide and 48" long. The buff sling is listed for sergeants, and is shown as 1" wide and 39" long. It has 2 leather loops and a rectangular buckle which appears to be identical in shape to the metal adjustment buckle used on the waistbelt, but of course sized for the sling. The style of sling utilizing thongs/ties is not illustrated, but of course, that doesn't mean it wasn't available. Captain Petrie is simply listing what was currently considered "issue" in 1865. With the contracts being let in 1861, etc, other and earlier models may well have been available for sale.
If the moderators will permit it, I would gladly scan the image and post it. I am just uncertain as to the copyright of a 139 year old drawing in a 21 year old publication, especially when the images are credited to other sources
Anyway, the images certainly show enfields with English pattern slings.

respects,

[Guardsman]

I bought an Enfield sling from Czekanski a few years before he stop producing, it’s beautiful. It’s all black with the rough side out, no buckle and tied with a leather thong at the trigger guard swivel. I’ve never seen anything come close to matching it.

[major]

I bought an Enfield sling from Czekanski a few years before he stop producing, it’s beautiful. It’s all black with the rough side out, no buckle and tied with a leather thong at the trigger guard swivel. I’ve never seen anything come close to matching it.

Jim
If you go back to message #7 of this thread you may find a picture of what you are describing.
Terry

[12thtxPvt]

Many moons ago, a white canvas sling w/ a sewn on leather reenforcing strip was considered the Enfield sling. Was it based on ANY WBTS sling or was it a military sling at all?

Just wondering.

Gil Tercenio
I'm looking at a picture, in Francis A. Lord's "Civil War Collector's Encyclpedia", of 2 rifle slings (page 120). A description of this picture is on page 118, describing the British Enfield Gun Sling, used by the Confederates, as Light canvas material, 30 inches long, with 2 leather loops, and a heavy wire hook on the end. The U.S. Gun Sling as Russet leather, 38 1/2 inches long, with 2 loops and a brass hook on the end.
By the way...
Is Francis A. Lord's "Civil War Collector's Encyclpedia" a good reference to use?

Pvt. Phillip Allen
12th Texas Infantry

[48Sarge]

I stopped using my Enfiels sling on the rifle a long time ago. Now I use it to carry my bed roll. Works alot better than it did on my rifle! :)

[Ian M.]

Just picked up this very informative, but old, thread. Having rad through all posts, it seems at least one question remains:

1. Was it relatively common for U.S. State/Fed units with the Enfield 1855 to use British-supplied black leather slings? Conversely, would these have been quickly replaced by natural/russet U.S. slings (and did the length mean anything since Enfield slings are longer)? I am particulalry interested in what the practice of state units (other than Mass., think west) may have been.

I've checked many period photos but unfortunately have not found anything conclusive on either question.

[militiaman1835]

In the 1970's I bought dozens of these standing loop slings from SARCO INC. They came in various shades of brown & black and those that were dated had pre WW1 up to 1920's dates. We did the gun show circuit and put them on Martini-Henrys, sniders, rolling blocks, etc. At the time we were told they were Lee-Medford slings though they supposedly went back to the martin-henry. In Craig Barry's book: The Civil War Musket A handbook for Historical Accuracy, he has a section on slings. There is a two band rifle sling in russet brown and the 53 sling. The way I read it and see it the standing loop goes on to the triggerguard swivel. The brass adjustment buckle is NOT sewn on but is a floating adjustment between the strap. The sliding leather keeper is on the upper swivel end. Hard to discribe so look for yourself and decide. This is shown in another plate of british equipment from a book I copied it out of but didn't write the name on it. Also on page 67 is a good photo of a federal soldier with a U.S. sling on his enfield. Perhaps one of the royal museums in the UK could shed light on these slings? JIM HENSLEY

[Jimmayo]

Many moons ago, a white canvas sling w/ a sewn on leather reenforcing strip was considered the Enfield sling. Was it based on ANY WBTS sling or was it a military sling at all?


Here is a picture of what I believe is a canvas CS sling on a Springfield. The giveaway is the wire hook and the two piece sling material. It really does not show up very well on this blow up but it is there.

[Craig L Barry]

Jim Hensley makes some good observations about the period correct Enfield slings as shown and discussed in The Civil War Musket, (Watchdog 2006). Several years ago the chapter on "How To Sling A Musket" was first published as a separate article in the Watchdog and there was quite a bit of controversy on the matter (for reasons I've never understood...the record seems clear enough). The main point was then as it is now...the buckle type sling was known to be in use, but if any one finds an actual period photo of a Civil War soldier with the type sling (pictured in post # 7 on this thread), that is a loose leather thong tied sliding keeper sling on his Enfield, please share it with the rest of us. There are a few reproductions offered of this sling, and as Jim points out these are based on specimens manufactured for weapons used well after the Civil War. These later British slings were often put on P-53 Enfields and were "making the gun show circuit" years and years ago. You can find numerous reproductions of incorrect slings widely sold "for the Enfield".

By way of confirming the information previously published on this point in The Civil War Musket, another book has recently come out on British Accoutrements by Pierre Turner that dates the type (pictured in post # 7) "loose leather thong, tied at the bottom, sliding keeper" sling to November 1871. At least that's what the research on British slings seem to support about the matter...a fact that helps explain why there are no known period images found with that sling. However, there are many, many Civil War-era pictures of Enfields where the buckle slings can clearly be identified.

To summarize the point on "correct" vs "incorrect" Enfield slings:

Unless your US unit does an early war Massachusetts impression, the state purchased and issued full British accoutrements in mid-1861, a Federal Enfield would normally be issued a US rifle-musket leather sling along with other US accoutrements...the leather sling made for the US 1861 fits an Enfield just fine. The Columbia Rifles Research Compendium (2nd Edition Watchdog 2007) has a good chapter on US slings. In 1861 as part of a state contract, some Massachusetts units did get British accoutrements with buckle slings, but these were miniscule in number compared to the number of US slings issued. As I recall, the buckles on those Massachusetts contract Brit slings were "D" shaped. They also had the Enfield cartridge box and bayonet scabbard. The state of Massachusetts sold off their extra accoutrements to other states, so these buckle slings would not have been unknown in the North, just much less commonly encountered than the US variety. For a Federal impression, the best choice is probably a US rifle musket sling field modified to fit the P-53 Enfield.

Full sets of British accoutrements (for the P-53 Enfield) were more commonly purchased by the Confederates, including cartridge box, cap pouch frog (no buckle) and scabbard. A commonly encountered sling was the Enfield "Rifle" version, black leather, buckle closure, w/ a fixed bottom keeper. The rifle sling was slightly longer than the white buff rifle-musket sling because the rear swivel on the two band rifle was located behind the trigger guard. Our modern reproduction two band Enfield rifle with the rear swivel on the trigger guard is actually what would then have been called a "Naval Rifle". There was no British made sling in brown russet leather to my knowledge. As Geoff Walden has often pointed out, the elongated hook type US style slings marked "S. Isaac Campbell & Company" are modern fabrications which even mis-spell the address of the firm. Trans Mississippi Depot (Don Smith) is working on a version of the black Enfield "Rifle" buckle type sling with the assistance of the Watchdog staff and Wayne Moug of the Royal Canadian Museum in Halifax. The proto-type has been evaluated and returned to TMD with comments, and it is a commendable effort that will complement their other fine products. Expect to hear more about the TMD Enfield buckle sling in the near future.

CS cloth/linen slings varied in length, but were made as short as 34" and produced for the CS Richmond rifle-musket. These would not fit an Enfield unless the top sling swivel was relocated to the middle band. Hence, I would not characterize a cloth/linen sling as produced solely "for the Enfield", that is a modern conceit. A longer cloth/linen sling would fit an Enfield and a variety of other rifles, muskets and rifle-muskets arms as well.

Or if you are unsure of a proper sling for your impression what I would suggest is to use no sling at all.

[militiaman1835]

Here is photo of sling we are discussing. By the way: RICHMOND DEPOT makes a nice QUALITY sling with authentic cast buckle. If the buckle was not sewn on sling it could be correct. JIM HENSLEY

[Rob]

I have one of Richmond Depot's black leather Enfield "buckle" slings. The buckle is not stitched. It's held on by friction.

[Craig L Barry]

Yes, great point. Richmond Depot offers a fine reproduction of the Enfield buckle sling, and this is mentioned in The Civil War Musket as well as the Watchdog article "How To Sling a Musket" and recommended as an acceptable choice. If the buckle were sewn on and not instead held on by friction it would be a very interesting project to install one of these...In fact, given the varietal ways standard hook and loop slings are installed by enactors (backwards, twisted and upside down...sometimes all at once), I hazard to guess what might happen without clear installation instructions for the more confusing Brit buckle slings.

The British buff leather "rifle-musket sling" has a different closure at the bottom and uses a single stitched leather strip and an iron button. See "Arms and Equipment of the British Army,1866" (Illustrated by Petrie). The buckle is sewn in place on that one. The black leather "rifle" sling works just as well on a P-53 as it is actually longer. I usually suggest an "extra" sliding keeper be used to cinch the sling (or hold it together) at the top band as one sliding keeper must be kept around the buckle closure to hold things together.

[Jim Mayo]

I compared Scott's sling buckle side by side with one that I found at Seven Pines. They were identical. There is a picture of it somewhere on the forums. Up until about 10 years ago, the use of this buckle was not well known and you could find them in some junk drawers at the relic shows. I did a little asking around to different relic hunters and this type buckle has been found in various sites in the eastern theater but not in as large quantities as if every enfield had a sling using them. Late war use is also documented by one found at Bentonville. Just thought I would throw that little tidbit of information out in case anyone was interested.

[Craig L Barry]

The Enfield sling buckles were often dug and "misidentified" as belt buckles or something else. Good point, Jim. Very common artifact which gives you some idea how widely used these Brit slings were in the CS.

The buckle sling closure can be tough to adjust on the march. It takes two hands to do it. Whatever the case, it is a very positive development that we are starting see common articles like the British Enfield sling authentically reproduced for the hobby, instead of all the post Civil War-era garbage and modern creations which was all that was available just a few years ago.

[Rob]

The buckle sling closure can be tough to adjust on the march. It takes two hands to do it.

Make that three. I thought I was the only one having this trouble. If you like to adjust your sling often, you probably want to stay away from this one.

And, yes, a third keeper on the upper swivel is a good idea.

[Craig L Barry]

My son (aka "the boy") uses the black Enfield buckle sling as well as other Enfield accoutrements as part of his impression both because it looks sharp and we do both US and CS as dictated by the needs of the event. Everything "crosses over" nicely. His sling dates from a few years ago (the dark ages) before there were any good reproductions. I made it for him. Nobody is going to mistake my workmanship w/ TMD or Richmond Depot, but it is a fair approximation of the originals. I just followed the pictures and descriptions in "Arms and Equipment of the British Army,1866. Illustrated by Petrie".

I had to help him get that buckle sling adjusted on the march as we had our hands full. I can easily understand the charm of the "improved" post Civil War design (loose leather thong tied w/ sliding keeper) sling as far as adjusting it on the march. However, like stainless steel canteens and speckled enamel ware cups, that sling just isn't right for the Civil War period. Pity me in these situations since I am little bit fussy about the details, I don't use a sling at all.

[Rob]

Authenticity aside for a moment, the problem I've had with the "sliding" slings - and I've owned two of them - is that once the sliding loop gets a bit loose, they start to adjust themselves, most notably when you don't want them to, like during manual of arms or firing drills. Not good.

[Craig L Barry]

Right, there is a need for a very tight sliding keeper against the top swivel of the sliding loop farby sling or do they self-adjust at inopportune moments...This is a downside to being easily adjusted on the march, it seems. No matter, the buckle sling is period correct and looks better, too.

There is a pretty easy way to convert one of the sliding keeper slings to a buckle sling, if it is a reasonably good piece of leather otherwise. In the part that is tied by the thong to the bottom swivel, reverse it and modify that part to hold the buckle, drill some holes and install it backwards. The key is getting a good buckle.

[militiaman1835]

Perhaps Scott at The Richmond Depot would be willing to undertake selling just the buckle to convert existing lace type slings to correct pattern by reversing them and adding buckle as Craig suggests? Jim Hensley

[Craig L Barry]

The buckles are (supposedly) available through Naugatuck Novelty, at least they were. I believe that is where TMD is getting them. BIockade Runner has a decent brass sling buckle, though it is sold as a buckle for a belt or something else.

Anyway, that is how I used to reconfigure the sliding loop sling into the buckle type sling before there were good reproductions available. It is not difficult and not expensive, just hard to adjust on the march.

[Richmond Depot]

I would be happy to sell all that I can get my hands on. Unfortunately, I can't get them at present and that is why I'm not currently offering the slings.

As a side note, I have not seen any mention of the D shaped Enfield buckles. You guys seem to be forgetting about them. :D

While it may be a coincidence, it would seem that from existing photo's that the sling buckles used by CS troops were of the rectangular pattern and those in use by the US troops from Mass. utilized the D shaped buckle.

I had posted several photo's on this thread prior to the crash of both US and CS troops using the two types of Enfield slings. However, like Margret Mitchell's book, they seem to be Gone with the Wind.

[militiaman1835]

Roy Najecki who makes rev war items has a sling buckle that may be close to the brass british D one. It is brass buckle #EX. Take a look and see what you think. I do not have one to compare it to. Jim Hensley

[Craig L Barry]

Scott:
Yes, you are right. The CS buckles (I have seen) were rectangular and the Massachusetts contract buckle slings were D-shaped. Interesting observation there. The key is getting the right buckle, the rest of it is pretty straightforward.

[Jimmayo]

Thought I would post this for info. This buckle was found at Seven Pines in the same yard as a Va. staff.

[Craig L Barry]

Yep, that is the Enfield sling buckle. Blockade Runner (BRI) sells a copy of it, and that is similar to what I have used in the past. The Civil War Musket has an identical picture to this one of a period sling buckle. They were apparently quite common as they are found "dug" at Confederate camp sites as well as battlefields.

[Ian M.]

Unless your US unit does an early war Massachusetts impression, the state purchased and issued full British accoutrements in mid-1861, a Federal Enfield would normally be issued a US rifle-musket leather sling along with other US accoutrements...the leather sling made for the US 1861 fits an Enfield just fine. The Columbia Rifles Research Compendium (2nd Edition Watchdog 2007) has a good chapter on US slings. In 1861 as part of a state contract, some Massachusetts units did get British accoutrements with buckle slings, but these were miniscule in number compared to the number of US slings issued. As I recall, the buckles on those Massachusetts contract Brit slings were "D" shaped. They also had the Enfield cartridge box and bayonet scabbard. The state of Massachusetts sold off their extra accoutrements to other states, so these buckle slings would not have been unknown in the North, just much less commonly encountered than the US variety. For a Federal impression, the best choice is probably a US rifle musket sling field modified to fit the P-53 Enfield.

Apparently a number of other state units in Federal service purchased the Enfield in addition to Massachusetts. Sling aside, what accouterments would they typically have used? For example, I don't think the Springfield bayonet fit the Enfield, and the Enfield bayonet did not (again I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong) fit in the Springfield scabbard. Cap and cartridge box I could see being interchangeable but would these states have used the Enfield bayonet, scabbard and frog (and if the frog, are we talking the one WITH the buckle)?

Finally, just to be clear, the correct Enfield sling would have had the rough-side out right? The picture of the reproduction from RD appears to be this way but hard to tell for sure.

[Craig L Barry]

Some good questions...Let's clarify:

First, it is correct other Federal states had their own P-53 commercial contracts, some of which included full sets of accoutrements. Additionally, Massachusetts sold off their excess accoutrements, so other states issued them early in the war as well. The best known is perhaps the mid-1861 contract with the state of Massachusetts which I think was 10,000 sets. However, these are thousands against the millions of sets of US accoutrements issued during the Civil War-era.

Full sets of accoutrements usually include the waist belt, cap pouch, cartridge box, sling and bayonet scabbard. However I believe the Massachusetts contract was for "stands of arms" which would include the rifle-musket, sling and bayonet. An important distinction.Slings were an item of ordnance and as such not considered “normal equipage” for replacement and procurement through the quartermaster department like tents, axes, clothes or food.

A P-53 bayonet will definitely fit in a US pattern ("Gaylord") scabbard. Hundreds of thousands of Federal soldiers carried their Enfield bayonets just that way. Federal accoutrements were the norm for the Enfield in the US Army, the Brit accoutrements were the notable exception. Period photos show multiple examples of Enfield toting Federals with full US accoutrements.

The so-called "Enfield" frog (with buckle) was designed for the two band rifle with the longer, heavier sword type bayonet. The British style rifle-musket frog would not normally have a buckle. Period photos of soldiers from the 44th Mass show them outfitted in full British accoutrements including Brit frogs/scabbards carrying P-53 Enfields equipped with buckle slings. IIRC, these were 9 month volunteers.

As Geoff Walden, the sine quo non of the Civil War Enfield (at least in our hobby), points out earlier in this string the black British rifle sling is rough side out but waxed such that the finish is almost smooth.

[Jimmayo]

For example, I don't think the Springfield bayonet fit the Enfield, and the Enfield bayonet did not (again I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong) fit in the Springfield scabbard.

The Springfield bayonet would not fit in the Enfield scabbard because of the brass throat and the shape of the blade. BUT, never say never. The first picture is an Enfield scabbard throat that has been modified to take a springfield bayonet blade. The enfield socket bayonet fits fine in a US scabbard.

The second picture is interesting because it shows a dug enfield and a dug springfield both with springfield bayonets attached. These came from a CS position.

It may be of further interest to some that out of 10 rifles dug in the vicinity of these two, these were the only ones with bayonets attached.