Two Officers-Unknowns

[rogue]

This is an albumin image I own.

Mr. Sullivan, I'm sure by your relatively high post count that you are aware that we do not allow unsigned posts on the AC. In future might I suggest you engage the Auto Sig feature located in your user CP. Further infractions may result in a change of your account status. Justin Runyon, AC Moderator

[DixieLand1859]

I dont see an image...?

[rogue]

I dont see an image...?
How preceptive!
This was a total error message, I have been trying, unsuccessfully, to post a neat image I won, and this thread was posted by mistake, and without my name even appearing. I have been reprmanded by an NCO, and accept blame for the error.
When I hit "Manage Attachments" nothing happens. Just last week I posted an odd cartridge box on this forum, and it worked.
Now, and I just tried again, I cannot post, "Manage Attachments" does not work for me, here and now. Very frustrating. Nothing has changed at my end since last week, and I had read an earlier thread in which others demonstrated the system works. Very frustrating!
Steve Sullivan
46th Illinois
Co. Mil. Hist.

[Justin Runyon]

Posted for Mr. Sullivan as per his request. Below is what steve sent me with regard to provenence etc.

Justin, This is a six by four inch albumin. I got it at an antique shop here in Elgin, Illinois. It came from an estate sale from a family with no known military heritage or service. It appears to be in its original frame, and it bears nether photographers mark or any written inscription. The two fellows have uniforms which appear gray in color, but the insignia visible is unlike any I have seen.
The late Dick Tibbals and I, both Associate Editors of Military Images, had puzzled long and hard over this, and had come up empty. Perhaps French, or early Illinois militia? The cut of the uniforms appears CW era, but beyond the obvious???
Steve Sullivan

[rogue]

THANK YOU Justin, now, let the fun begin. Who are they?
Steve Sullivan
46th Illinois
Co. Mil. Hist.

[markj]

Pretty odd image, to say the least. It seems to incorporate both elements of French and American uniforms, swords, etc. Possibly the best clues are the devices on the fronts of the men's kepis. If these could be identified they could provide important leads--the device worn by the man on the left almost looks like a "bursting bomb." These men could well be French Army, given that similar uniforms were worn at least into the 1870's. However, I think the shoulder straps appear to be "American." The swords worn by the men might also be good leads--a look in standard sword reference works might nail down their origin.

Here's another possibility: neither of these men are actually military but are, instead, actors posed in a scene from a play. This might explain the seeming hodgepodge of different uniforms, swords, etc. A couple of years ago, I purchased a large 1860's tintype depicting three citizens (two women and a man) and they are clearly posed as if they were acting in some unnamed 19th Century melodrama.

One more possibility is that these men were in a state militia unit (possibly in Illinois). As has long been known, uniforms worn by state militia units before, during, and after the Civil War could vary significantly from official U.S. Army regulations. A number of Northern units (e.g., in New York), which wore blue uniforms during the Civil War, switched back to their traditional gray uniforms almost as soon as the war ended.

Neat image, whoever it depicts!

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Ringgold]

Good points, Mark!

There is yet another possibility - Military Institute/Academy instructors. This photo subject has caused me fits in the past on numerous occassions! They adhered to NO uniform code and borrowed uniform ideas from every army on the planet regardless of time frame or ornamentation. GEEZE!