Manns patent cartridge box

[swampyankee76]

I’m interested if there is anyone reproducing the Manns patent cartridge box. If anyone can give me some information it would be much appreciated.


Caleb Horton

[1stMaine]

Comrade,

Although he's not an approved vendor on this site, Jim Lammers of Cedar Creek Supply Depot used to make a VERY accurate copy of the Mann's system accoutrements. I'm not certain he made the spring-loaded tin shelf system for the cartridges, but eveything else was well made and well researched.

The fellows of the 15th New Jersey all had sets made by him, and it was a treat at Spotsylvania LH programs to see them using the system, as their original unit did in 1864 at those very sites.

I don't know if he still makes them, but a google search ought to bring up contact info for him. It's worth your time to check, anyway.

Respects,

[jgr1974]

I would love to try and see one of these! I have tried to buy an original, but are always out of my price range. If I had dimensions and good photos I could probably make one!

I think these are a really neat box! I have a supplier who sells the correct buckles.

[swampyankee76]

Theres one at my local historical society. Identified to a man in the 2nd Rhode Island. Its in great condition and if i had any skills in leather making. I would reproduce it Thats great to know that Ceder Creek Makes a box, i'll check it out. Its very underepresented in this hobby. By the way does he sell the belt that goes with it aswell? Thanks

Caleb horton

[1stMaine]

Comrades,

Keep in mind that the Mann's system accoutrements are unit-specific, and primarily 6th Corps 1864-1865. The 15th New Jersey was one unit that was completely equipped as a field test of the system at Col. Mann's own expense.

I do not have the list of units which used this system at hand, but I'll see if I can locate it and post it here. Regardless, it was a small group.

For what it's worth, those men who were issued it sang it's praises, and having used a set myself, I can attest to it being extremely comfortable and useful.

Jim Lammers offered an entire set for sale at one time, including the box, belt, and cap box and bayonet scabbard. The latter two were standard Federal issue items. Mann's contribution, in the main, was the box and belt.

As to the belt, if he doesn't produce it at this time, it is still easily made. It was simply a standard US waistbelt, and instead of the oval US buckle, it used the three-prong arrow hooks alone. Thus, all you need to do is get a hold of a set of the arrow hooks (they are made in a "Y" shape with the arrow points on each leg of the "Y") and use it as you would an oval buckle.

The buckle connected to the other end of the belt and rested behind the cartridge box. Again, a neat and comfortable system, although as I caustion, it is unit and date specific, so wouldn't be appropriate for anything before the Overland Campaign.

Respects,

[Ross L. Lamoreaux]

I've looked at Mr. Lammer's sets several times and talked at length with him about the research and original(s) involved in his reproduction. They are a very faithful copy, including the tins, and I would recommend them for those specific units that they were issued to. Although I don't remember at this time all of the units he discussed, I remember him mentioning the NJ unit as well as "high numbered Kentucky units".

[Hargis, G. 5 A-1]

Speaking of Cedar Creek, the zu-zus of 95th Penn. Inf. were issued Mann's equipments in '64 after the BATTLE of Cedar Creek.

[swampyankee76]

please ignore my double post.

[swampyankee76]

As i have mentioned before. The one i've been looking at was identified to a man in the 2nd Rhode. I can't remember his name off hand but i know that its a unit specific box. Captain Charles W. Gleason who died at sailor's creek, said that the "men complained about their new manns patent boxes, which bounced off their chests when they ran". So they where'nt all much loved by the men. The 2nd Rhode Island was in the 6th Corps 3rd Brigade, 1st Division when the boxes where issued.

[1stMaine]

As i have mentioned before. The one i've been looking at was identified to a man in the 2nd Rhode. I can't remember his name off hand but i know that its a unit specific box. Captain Charles W. Gleason who died at sailor's creek, said that the "men complained about their new manns patent boxes, which bounced off their chests when they ran". So they where'nt all much loved by the men. The 2nd Rhode Island was in the 6th Corps 3rd Brigade, 1st Division when the boxes where issued.

Comrade,

Interesting comment. I wonder if they were wearing them correctly. I only ask because I have used them, and even when running didn't have the sort of problem he describes. With the waistbelt worn through the box loops, and the shoulder straps hooked up, it rides pretty stable, even with actual rounds (I used some lead weights to replicate the weight of 40 rounds) and didn't flop near as much as the regular style does.

Again, a very interesting thread. Thanks for bringing the subject up.

Respects,

[swampyankee76]

I can get the source for you if you'd like. I'll have to dig it up in my library some where :wink_smil. I've never actually used one so i wouldnt know how it would feel myself but i would definetly take your word for it. When i get the time i will do a little more research into his account. I'll have to send Ceder Creek an email and see if he can reproduce me a box. Thanks for the information, i appreciate your contribution since i know nothing of this box, or how to even wear it

[easttnfed]

If I remember right, Jim has one already made on hand that he has not sold yet. I agree that his Mann's accoutrements are of very good quality (and I'm just saying that because I work for him :D )

The box is simply worn in front where your normal belt buckle is placed. The closure tab's hole is meant to fit over one of your coat buttons for you can easily get to the cartridges without having the flap in the way. He'll explain the whole jist of it when you purchase the set.

[swampyankee76]

Awesome, thanks for your help guys.

[Toney]

I do not if they are still for sale or not but last year a copy of the original drawing turn in for the Mann equipment patent was floating at the Nashville CW show last year. I saw the drawings and there were period including both text and detailed drawing of the items. I do not remember the dealers name, since I did not see them at his table but he was showing them to another dealer when I saw them. Mann’s patent stuff is always for sale at the CW shows.

Joe Toney

[Calico Boys]

Chums,

I just got thinking about this today, and remembered there was a post about the Mann's accoutrements. Does anyone have a complete list of regiments that were issued these sets? I know several 6th corps units recieved them. Reminds me of the gutta-percha knapsacks ( although you cant get them anywhere).

thanks,

[Calico Boys]

Nick,

In regards to the gutta-purcha knapsacks, several regiments recieved these. At least 1 company of the 151st NY, 114th NY, I have heard references of the 86th NY recieving them, 143rd NY etc..

[Calico Boys]

Nick,

Not talking about the manns knapsacks, talking about the gutta-purcha knapsacks.

Casey