position of rear rank arm's during a charge

[J.Smiley]

Could someone tell me what position the rear rank soldier should be in during a batallion charge, my 1st Sargent say's that right shoulder shift is the proper position. I feel that this instruction is wrong. I have seen soldiers at shoulder arms and port arms in the past during charges and cannot find anything in the search function on this subject

[Greg Renault]

Both ranks go to arms port while advancing; the front rank goes to the "charge bayonet" position just prior to contact. If the assault is made by more than one battle line (eg, a column), the lines behind the front one remain at right shoulder shift. See Dom dal Bellos article: http://www.33wis.com/articles/pdf/chargebayonet.pdf

Greg Renault

[john duffer]

At last an easy, non-controversial question

The generic standard of the reenacting world seems to be front rank at Charge-BAYONET/rear at Right Shoulder Shift - a study by Dom Dal Bello supports front rank Charge-Bayonet/rear at Arms-Port - a study by Tom Wheeley of Lazy Jacks Mess supports both ranks at Charge-BAYONET, who's right ?

Hardee, Gilham & Casey give the position of Charge-BAYONET but don't mention the rear rank. Scott's ABSTRACT implies both (all three) ranks come to Charge-BAYONET :

273. SECOND MOTION. (Pl. IV. Fig. 8.) Bring down the firelock with the right hand Into the left, which seizes it a little above the swell, the barrel uppermost, the left elbow near the body, the right hand against the right haunch, the point of the bayonet as high as the eye. The men in the rear rank will take care to avoid touching the men, who are in front of them, with their bayonets.

There is a plate in Scott's 1861 update showing three ranks all at Charge-BAYONET.

The ABSTRACT is also the only manual I've seen which gives details on making a bayonet charge but here seems to imply that only the fronk rank goes to the charge when the moment comes:

466. When a battalion or line is to charge bayonet, the whole are, in the first instance, to come to Arms—PORT, and advance at a firm, quick step, but in the most perfect order possible, until they reach the enemy. (See No. 545.)

467. It is at that instant that the front rank are necessarily to bring their firelocks down to the charging position, and the whole are to press forward with the utmost energy. The enemy being routed, It will depend on the officer commanding to give the word HALT; when the front rank will resume the position of Arms—PORT, and proceed as may be afterwards directed. But the word HALT is on no account to be given during a charge, or as preparatory to the front rank bringing the firelock down to the charging position. It is, therefore, to be understood, that, in the charge, or quick attack upon the enemy with fixed bayonets, either previous to, or after firing, (which usually commences at a distance of one hundred, or one hundred and fifty yards, as the ground may permit,) the charging position of the front rank is to be assumed only at the instant of attack or defence.

545. In the last fifteen or twenty steps of a charge, and in other circumstances requiring great celerity of movement, troops having a front not exceeding that of a battalion may quicken the march to the rate of one hundred and fifty steps in a minute for a limited time; but as a line marching at this rate for more than one hundred paces would be liable to break, this measure of acceleration will not be considered a prescribed head of instruction, and consequently the troops are to be exercised in the quick time of one hundred and twenty steps a minute.

So that settles it right ? Maybe not. An important consideration is the difference in speed between 1830 and 1860, quicktime of 28" paces at 120 per minute versus double quick of 33" paces at 165 per minute. The faster pace requires a more stable arms carry, hence the Right Shoulder Shift becoming the default. From H. L. Scott's 1861 MILITARY DICTIONARY:

When the affair has begun, and the position and dispositions of the enemy are known, and the proper effect has been produced by firing, the infantry may march to the charge,
with the arms at a carry or on the right shoulder, leaving to the instinct of the soldier the determination of the proper moment of bringing the musket to the position of charge bayonet.

What do illustrations reveal ? I found examples of both ranks at Charge-BAYONET, front rank at Charge-Bayonet w/ rear at Arms-PORT and front rank at Charge-BAYONET and rear rank at Right Shoulder Shift !

The remainder is purely speculation on my part but it would seem that all of these could be correct depending on the drill background of the officers of a particular unit. The Charge-BAYONET position is also odd in that it seems to be described for a stationary position, although some illustrations show the men moving quickly in this position it would seem more intended to be the final step before actually engaging in bayonet fighting.

[10TnVI]

HI John- my own contribution to the debate -fwiw-
From "The Civil War Letters of Wilbur Fisk"- Fisk was in the 2nd Vermont
The time place is during a brigade review held on May 14, 1864-

"At the command "Forward March", all started at once. "Charge Bayonets" was the next order and every man grasped his musket with both hands, the cold steel extending in front, ready for immediate use. At the word "double quick" we set up a yell and started on the run."

So here we have a veteren unit ,with over 2 years experience, which uses both ranks at Charge bayonets, and even uses the order rather than waiting until approach of impact. So far this is the only period account I've found discussing the mechanics of a bayonet charge.

[Curt Schmidt]

Hallo Kameraden!

As with similar questions...just to add that perhaps there is not one, universal, answer :

At times, it may have come down to what "manual" the commanding officer (and men) were instructed and trained under/with.
And the accounts will vary as a result.. ;-)

Curt-Heinrich Schmidt

[markj]

Pray allow me to pour even more oil on the fire:

"Charge bayonet" didn't necessarily mean "charge bayonet." Here's "Exhibit A":

While at NARA looking through the court-martial transcript of a 10th Indiana officer, who was accused of falsifying his AAR after the Battle of Mill Springs KY (19 Jan 62), I was surprised to find a fairly detailed description of how the culminating bayonet charge was carried out. Specifically, an enlisted man (who was in the first rank) stated he carried his rifle "at the trail." He subsequently went into rather graphic detail about how he bayoneted a Confederate he found "hiding behind a tree." Gruesome stuff.

What all this means is that the term "charge bayonet" was a pretty flexible term and could just as easily mean "Charge [with] bayonet [fixed]." Another question, when discussing charges with "both ranks down" was how to avoid the rear rank stabbing the front. I discovered the answer to this question in, of all places, an 1811 Massachusetts militia manual; namely, direct the rear rank to take a side step so their pieces fill the interval between their file leaders and the men on their left (or right, depending on how you do it). No muss, no fuss, and it significantly reduces the chance of accidental stabbings.

Regards,

Mark Jaeger

[Vuhginyuh]

At times, it may have come down to what "manual" the commanding officer (and men) were instructed and trained under/with.

...and the urgency of the moment.

[Kevin O'Beirne]

It's about time we revisited this. :-)

In short, I believe that several methods were used, depending on what regiment one is talking about, during the war. There's certain ample evidence from manuals that the "both ranks at arms port/front rank goes to charge bayonet upon meeting the enemy" was used, plus it just makes plain common sense. There's some documentation, depending on how you "define" that word, for the "front rank to charge bayonets/rear rank to right shoulder shift", among the most compelling of which is Alfred Waud's sketch of the 71st NY advancing with arms held this way at Fair Oaks VA in 1862.

Certainly it's well documented that "charges"--note: I mean a rush on the enemy's line, not necessarily a "bayonet charge"--with both ranks at right shoudler shift, and with both ranks at trail arms. Both of these arms-carry positions are documented in the manuals and first-person accounts as being used when a line advanced at the double quick. Certainly the idea of double-quicking at an enemy line was to close with the enemy and probably, hopefully, engage them in hand-to-hand combat, kinda like "a bayonet charge".

Like many other drill-related "things" in the war, I suspect there were a myriad of ways to charge the enemy's line per some manual somebody wrote. Without definitive proof, it's difficult to say for sure which is "correct" and which ones are "wrong".

Whew. Glad I could contribute to this one. :-)

[DougCooper]

It also depends on your definition of advance vs charge. A unit might advance for 2-300 yards before charging the last few rods. Advancing at right shoulder shift or even shoulder arms until getting within "charge" range seems to be the method of choice. One of the more famous such charges was the 1st Minn at Gettysburg on July 2 - at least 4-1 odds, it was truly a forlorn hope. Adjutant Lochren mentions "utmost speed" as their only hope to close with the rebs before all could be killed or wounded. Most pictures and accounts show right shoulder shift and/or arms port with both ranks as they ran down the slope. They came to "charge bayonets" at some point as Lochren says: a line of soldiers "in evident desperation coming at a run with bayonets fixed" apparently brought the rebs to a halt and disorder in the center without actual contact. At this point, they raised and fired directly in the faces of the rebs and slugged it out for 10-15 minutes until lapped on both flanks before the tiny remnant retired. Raising to fire from the charge bayonet position is a simple, quick move and must have been devastating to a line already wavering. .

There must be some distance at which you bring the weapons down that is a compromise between speed/order vs the menace of cold steel. Running 500 yards at charge bayonets makes no sense - hard to run in that position anyway and keep together. The last 50 yards might makes sense as the proximity of the bayonets would be perfectly clear. The entire theory of smoothbore tactics was hinged on the power = speed + bayonet and to spend as little time inside the killing range of the defender's weapons. That whole equation was altered when rifled weapons extended the range. The 1st Minn, though grossly outnumberd, had speed, valor and a gentle slope on their side. Otherwise, their dramatic charge would have been just another statistic that day.

Anyway, so a unit advancing at the right shoulder shift comes down to charge bayonets at some point. I can't see the rear rank remaining at that position - it is in no way a "ready" position for anything - only one hand is on the weapon. Arms port makes perfect sense from a defensive/ready/safety sense, whereas charge bayonets make more sense to get as many bayonet points facing the enemy as possible. I wonder if there was a nominal "charge range" taught to officers, and how that changed with the new weapons?

[Silas]

Just to muddle things a little is this letter from Wm. D. Rogers of the 1st Florida.

Tullahoma, Tennessee
April 17th 1863

Dear Papa and Mother,

It is with great pleasure that I take my knapsack on my knee and my pen in hand to write you a few lines informing you that I am very well at present and hope they may find you all enjoying the same.

I have no news at all to write everything is exactly the same as when I wrote last the only thing that has transpired since then that is worth relating is a review we had the other day.

A general review of Breckenridges Div. Genls Hardee and Polk were both present and after we had passed in review they called on Genl Breckenridge for three of the best Regiments he had, they wanted to see them drill and decide which was the best. Genl B selected our Regt, the 18th Tenn. and the 20th Lou as the best he had, and we at once commenced. Our Regt drilled first. Lieut Col Mashbourne of the 3rd Fla drilled us. We all did ouir best as we wanted to get the praise but the 18th Tenn beat us and got the praise of being the best and our Regt 2nd best.

Just before oiur Regt quit the Col go kus in line of battle across the old field and told us he wanted us to make a charge just like we did when we charged the Yanks. We started in common time but didn't get far before he gave us the command "Charge Bayonets, Douible Quick, March" when the front rank came to a charge and the rear rank to "right shoulder shift arms" we made the charge and yelled with as much spirit as if the Yanks had been there sure enough.

The Genls waved their hats to us and said was very well done but the 18th Tenn beat us, they went through the same that we did and when they made the charge they got about half-way across the field yelling as loud as they could when all at once the Drum tapped and they all dropped like they were dead even the Col and his horse both come down. The horse lay as close the ground as he could get and the Col right behind him. They all lay for several minutes before they got up.

It beat any thing I ever saw in my life and I never did hear such cheering in my life as was done when they dropped, they got the praise and well do they deserve it for they beat anything drilling that ever I say. The Col has his horse trained to lay down whenever he says to.

I received a letter from Jimmy & Sister the other day and also one from Johny. I have written to Jimmy and Johny both today.

Well, Papa and Mother, Goodbye for this time. Kiss all the children for me and write soon to your Affectionate Son

Wm D. Rogers