Riding with longarms in the saddle

[Forrestcavalryman]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

That's not a bad theory John! Tha could've been the logic behind it.

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

John's theory works about as good as any other. Makes perfect sense to me. Notice the location of the slide and ring down on the stock like that. If he did try to sling it, it would hang even closer to the ground than normal. However, if he were to hook it in that location and use a carbine socket, it may allow it to hang a little more parallel to the side of the horse sort of like a modern saddle boot. Of course all of this is speculation.

Paul, I understand what you mean about hindsight being 20/20. In our 'streamer days, one of our guys who considered himself a handyman of sorts took an original Dickson Nelson & Co. two band rifle (serial number 12... worth about $30,000 in good condition) and took a hacksaw to the barrel to make himself a "cavalry carbine". What an incredible waste of a rare relic and piece of American history. Sadly, he would have been much more authentic had he left it whole and carried it appropriately. But I guess it continuously got in the way of the double pommel holsters on his modified "Hope" saddle he made from a 1911 A-Fork mule drivers saddle.

Ironically, that same former member now owns a world famous gun shop in Baton Rouge and he's the star of his own TV show on the Discovery Channel. Go figure. At least I ended up with what was left of the "carbine" and it's gone to good use and is cherished for what it is.

[wavey1us]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Larry,
That is classic. Maybe you should go on the program with that "carbine" to see what he can do with it.

[tsgalloway]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Larry,
That is classic. Maybe you should go on the program with that "carbine" to see what he can do with it.

Yeah, he can restore it for you...hahaha...

[Mississippian]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Gun Boots. Starting to find references to them in the East now.

Will MacDonald

[TexCavly]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

However, if he were to hook it in that location and use a carbine socket, it may allow it to hang a little more parallel to the side of the horse sort of like a modern saddle boot.

Larry are you talking about those dragoon boots that you stick the end of the barrel in? Not the socket right?

[Paul L Muller]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

It was my good fortune to have cut down an Italian repo that I bought at a gun shop for 110.00 as a wall hanger. It just needed a good cleaning. I think God has a special place in pergatory if you cut down an origonal rear weapon. plm

[forrestcav]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

I thought i'd throw in my .02. If I remember correctly, the slant breech 59' sharps carbine was brass fitted and included both sling swivels and well as carbine ring for a sling. I have always cared my 2 band enfield slung across my back muzzle up. I did ass a wider folded canvas sling to diperse the weight a bit. As to the bucket, it was issued to dragoon troops and I believe was still in southern arsenals at the out break of the war. I have used on with my enfield and it helps on long rides, but I have found a need to keep a hand on it to reduce swinging to and fro. It also impedes the reins at times.

[Mike Nickerson]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Gun Boots. Starting to find references to them in the East now.

Will MacDonald

Will are you speaking about something that looks like this? If so, I would very much like to see that reference!

http://www.andersonmilitaria.com/images/belts_buckles/M1884CarbineBoot.jpg

Mike Nickerson

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Mike, I think the general consensus is that for the ACW period, the gun boots referred to in the ORs that Will provided are most likely the so called carbine thimble or socket we're most familiar with, but may have also reffered to the carbine buckets issued during the MAW period as well.

[Mike Nickerson]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Mike, I think the general consensus is that for the ACW period, the gun boots referred to in the ORs that Will provided are most likely the so called carbine thimble or socket we're most familiar with, but may have also reffered to the carbine buckets issued during the MAW period as well.

While I agree with everything you wrote Larry. The fact that Will was speaking of new references (like for the first time) for the use of "gun boots in the East" makes me wonder if he is talking about carbine thimbles. As I wasn't aware their use in the East was not considered common.

On the other hand, the use of the link pictured M1884 US Cavalry carbine boot is very commonly used by many "authentic deficit" Cav down here.

Mike Nickerson

[Prodical Reb]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Thanks Andrew. That is the type of thing I was looking for. Now, the next question. Would this be used with a carbine sling? I think the obvious answer would be yes, what else would the ring be for. BUT, there is always a "but"... With the lenght of that gun and the placement of the ring, that rifle would hang very close to the ground. Would this still work? Great photo though!

Now I'm not a Cav man but I think a carbine sling with this would work great on horse back but not so much on the ground. Spencer rifles are not that long. Depending on the soldiers height it would more than likely would drag the muzzle on the ground. As stated below would be great on horse back but only for short periods. I'll say why I think that in a minute.

I think the man would carry the rifle in hand, but in times of battle the gun would be connected to him (by sling), so that if he was unhorsed or had to drop the gun to take up a reign or any other emergency he would still have the rifle at his side. It would not be practical for the gun to be slung down for any length of time.

Normally the bar & ring were attached to the reciever when manufactured. To modify it in the field would result with the bar & ring attached to the wood as we see in the pic. The second thing to consider is how many Spencer rifles cracked or broke near to the recievers socket for the butt stock. With the magazine tube running thru the butt stock, it weakened the stocks considerably, so an arrangement like this could possibly render the weapon unservicable should the stock break.

[ButtermilkRanger]

Re: Riding with longarms in the saddle

Mike, I doubt we ever solve the mystery of the elusive gun boot, but it sure is fun to speculate, isn't it? :) I don't go to many local mainstream events, but at the couple local events I try to make, either as a spectator or a participant, I see the IW era boot pop up with more and more frequency. Of course, I'm also seeing more and more modern saddle pads, nylon curb chains, and gal troops. I guess one isn't any less authentic than the other.