Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

[roundshot]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

The white strap with leather tabs is one of his suspenders. This was a fairly common pattern in the 1860s.

[FloridaConscript]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Bob,
That was my 1st guess too, but they are OVER a haversack strap....that doesn't make any kind of sense.

[fahtz]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

"Ephraim Blevins- Clate great great uncle
John R. Baldwin great great uncle
Andrew Z. Blevins- great great grandfather."

I recall a conversation I had with Neal Sexton a year or so ago and he was convinced that these were the fellow's names as well... Weird how so many people have the exact same information...

[David Fox]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

This is a GREAT thread! What a gift for my Tuesday morning. Forensic history at its best. Those w/ the ability to "highly resolve" (sorry, Abe) photos should keep challenging us w/ their products. And I'm going to find that historic photos of Gettysburg book....

[FloridaConscript]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Also both federal canteens appear to be equipped with leather straps. Now, I'm no Federal kit expert, but didn't the cloth straps become more prevelant sometime in 1862??

[roundshot]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Actually, the canteen on the guy on the left is a CS issue concentric ring drum canteen, seen in several photos of NC Troops. Such association here is purely speculative, however.

[cap tassel]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Bob,
That was my 1st guess too, but they are OVER a haversack strap....that doesn't make any kind of sense.

It looks to me as if the haversack strap just slid under the suspender strap. The buckle ring of the other suspender strap is right where it should be
(under his pinky of the hand holding the jacket) if they are suspenders. The only thing is if they are suspenders they are heavy duty and seem to be over not only the haversack strap but whatever is cutting tightly underneath the same shoulder. What throws me off is what appears to be the ends of the suspender/trouser attachments on the opposite side.


Elaine, what do you think about that crease coming off of the same guy's shirt sleeve?


btw, #1 has always looked like George Harrison to me. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wynYMJwEPH8 :confused_ :tounge_sm

[PogueMahone]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Just my two cents here ...

That isn't a fence they are leaning against. Those appear to be railroad ties and scrap wood piled up.

Of the two you can see, they are wearing socks and you can't see their drawers hanging out of their pants legs. Two of the three have their coats off and gear on, so it must be a warm day, but they are prepared to march. This may be a missed point in many of our interpretations.

The first guy's haversack appears to contain a box. It is very square. His cup is tied on with a string, but it appears to be have been a recent addition because it has not yet caused permanent creases to his haversack strap. I believe that haversack was only recently issued. If anyone appeared at an event with that hat, people would tell them to buy a better one with a ribbon trim and hat band and maintain the shape better.

I think the guy in the middle is wearing the knapsack over one shoulder only, probably quickly done for the photographer. If someone could explain the straps dangling from the bag, we might be able to ID the type of bag. We've already had guesses of Federal issue, Confederate issue or Mex War and eliminated English import, all from the same writer!

The third guy's shirt was either issue, capture or purchased. His cuffs are rolled up, so it is doubtful anyone at home made it for him specificly or they would have known how long brother/son/husband's arms were.

[GreencoatCross]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Not sure if anyone touched on this yet but here goes....

The guy on the far right appears to be carrying a sack coat over his shoulder. It looks like a back vent slit clearly visible, and the length of the garment doesn't look like a jacket the way it hangs.

I also think Roundshot is correct; the visible, uncovered canteens both look like the concentric ring stamped CS drum canteens with wide leather straps. Federal canteen straps would be narrower, right?

[roundshot]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

The canteen in the middle is a Philadelphia pattern, one of the smaller concentric ring versions. Slings are whatever suited the man, be they altered musket slings, knapsack straps or the like. It's hard to ID a canteen by a sling at any time in the war. Plus, I believe the guy on the right has a Federal overcoat over his shoulder vs. a sack or frock. Just based on camparison with original examples.

[FloridaConscript]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

The first guy's haversack appears to contain a box. It is very square. His cup is tied on with a string, but it appears to be have been a recent addition because it has not yet caused permanent creases to his haversack strap. I believe that haversack was only recently issued. If anyone appeared at an event with that hat, people would tell them to buy a better one with a ribbon trim and hat band and maintain the shape better.


Joe,
Hardcrackers maybe???

[CJSchumacher]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Plus, I believe the guy on the right has a Federal overcoat over his shoulder vs. a sack or frock. Just based on camparison with original examples.

Are you sure?? There's no color discernable. It could be light blue, any shade of medium to light grey, tan, fawn, beige, light brown, etc., etc. That bottom hem looks finished as well along with the vent. I've yet to see an original Federal overcoat of the standard foot or mounted pattern with a finished bottom edge.

These guys mustn't be the real deal...they don't look anything like the "hardcore" reenactors I see in photos today. Where are the holes in clothing? All the rolled up pants? Waistbelts vs. braces? Confederates in "sporting shoes"? Loads of civilian clothing? Just rolled in the mud dirt? Hankerchiefs hanging out of their jackets, hats, sleeves, boot tops, musket barrels, etc. etc?

[justthemiller]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Hey Chris,

One thing about them that is missing in a lot of reproduction photos is that these fellows have the air of veteran soldiers about them. It's that hard yet subtle arrogant look that marks a soldier every time. Take care.

[CJSchumacher]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

Absolutely true, Miller.

That's a look that I, being a modern person with absolutely zero time in the modern military, could never recreate.

[minieball]

Re: Closeups of the three Gettysburg prisoners:

That is exactly the case according to information I recently learned in conversation with a local historical society in Pearisburg Va a local man there that I met at a grave marker ceremony has identified two of them as his kin ( cousin I think it was and ggfather) anyhow...if you'll notice the small pin like clasp on the collar of the thrid man..this was the giveaway, he also had a post war picture of his ggrand mother with the same pin on ( a sort of id pin with the mans name engraved) as I remember it he even convinced another 'noted local' Dr. James Robertson...the problem with this story is my faded memory but as I remember it they were NC troops ( the third man was from just a few countiues away Grayson co. Va on the NC line he enlisted in NC to serve with his other kinfolk believe their names were Henson??) they were captured and spent the next couple of days identifying the dead from their regiment and then left for Camp Douglas on July 7th er so...anyhow I emailed someone who should be able to fill in the chinks in my memory..more later

I can't see a clasp. What I do see are two buttons on his collar. He has moved slightly during the exposure causing the blurring and the buttons to register on the plate in multiple locations making it look something like a clasp.

Also both sides of the stereo negatives are in the LOC collection and available in .tiff format. I think I'll download them both and make a stereo card of it for my Holmes viewer.

Just my two cents worth.