corduory overshirt

[David Mitchell Norton]

Re: corduory overshirt

Wow I cannot believe how clear this photograph is! Anyone notice there are no suspenders? To hold his pants up it appears that he folded the waist band over. I wonder if this is coincidence? Does anyone know much about this?

David Norton

[Jeff Prechtel]

Re: corduory overshirt

If you look really close you'll see he's wearing a shell or sack coat AND an overcoat...
note the two collars at top left....above collar has two hook/eyes. the right overcoat body
seems to be underneath him and to the left. I'm thinking the material is cordoroy....and it's definitely
a shirt, and not a vest....you can see the end seam on the plaquet, about midway down the chest.
There also seems to be a definite shape & mass to the wales, except where it nears the neckline,
where it seems to "flatten" I pretty sure it's a cordoroy however, if you look near the waist on the
trousers, there seems to be a very pronounced shape & shadow to the fabric wales. Also, I don't
know if anyone else noticed but the trousers seems to be overly large on him, with lots of stains.....
I wonder if the trousers were "re-cycled" from someone. He certainly looks young.....18-20 maybe.

[Jefferson Guards]

Re: corduory overshirt

I am pretty sure that this image and shirt was discussed in a previous incarnation of the forum which has since been lost. I believe the consensus then was that the shirt was not manufactured from corduroy, but from a striped fabric. Due to the photographic process of the period, the stripes in the fabric cause an optical illusion that makes it appear as if the fabric has depth when it really does not. I have attached a enlargement of the two tiff documents from the stereo pair that the LOC has posted of this image. I believe in the highlighted sections you can see evidence of a twill weave to the fabric.

BTW the image citation is:

Petersburg, Va. Dead Confederate soldier, in trench beyond a section of chevaux-de-frise].
CREATED/PUBLISHED
1865 April 3.
SUMMARY
Photograph from the main eastern theater of war, the siege of Petersburg, June 1864-April 1865.
NOTES
Enlargement made from right half of stereo pair is filed in LOT 4168.
Reference: Civil War photographs, 1861-1865 / compiled by Hirst D. Milhollen and Donald H. Mugridge, Washington, D.C. : Library of Congress, 1977. No. 0426
Title from Milhollen and Mugridge.
Two plates form left (LC-B811-3183B) and right (LC-B811-3183A) halves of a stereograph pair.
MEDIUM
1 negative (2 plates) : glass, stereograph, wet collodion.
CALL NUMBER
LC-B811- 3183
REPRODUCTION NUMBER
LC-DIG-cwpb-02556 DLC (digital file from original neg. of left half)
LC-DIG-cwpb-02555 DLC (digital file from original neg. of right half)
LC-B8171-3183 DLC (b&w film copy neg.)
SPECIAL TERMS OF USE
No known restrictions on publication.

[OleMissRebel]

Re: corduory overshirt

I wonder where this poor boy took his wound at. There's no sign of an injury anywhere; no blood or gore in the shot.

[Andrew Kasmar]

Re: corduory overshirt

Hi,

I was wondering the same thing. I was going over some other original photos, such as a sniper in Devil's Den Gettysburg, and he does not appear to have a wound either. I also found a photo of a dead Confederate bayonted in the chest at Petersburg, you can see the wound but there is very little blood. Another possiblity is that the shirt is covering the wound, and the color of the shirt would help hide any blood stains.

Andrew Kasmar

4th Missouri Company E

[mslaird]

Re: corduory overshirt

I don't think it is likely that he has a head wound that is not visible due to the wooden object obstructing the view to his face. The head does not appear to show any evidence of deformity. It is possible that internal trauma from concussion killed him. It happens one in a while with artillery and other explosion casualties that are not directly hit by shrapnel or debris. I don't think that his trousers are doubled over at the waist though, you can see his suspender button above his right pocket clearly. I think that he has his shirt tucked into the top of his drawers and it is the top of the drawers that can be seen. After long examination, I think that the shirt is just a horizontal striped pattern, rather than corduroy.

[thad gallagher]

Re: corduory overshirt

I think head trauma could still be a possibility. If you look to the right of the post, it appears to be hair. That seems a bit out of line with what we can see of his face.

[OleMissRebel]

Re: corduory overshirt

Hi,
I also found a photo of a dead Confederate bayonted in the chest at Petersburg

Andrew Kasmar

4th Missouri Company E

Which "Petersburg dead" photo is that?

[OleMissRebel]

Re: corduory overshirt

I think that he has his shirt tucked into the top of his drawers and it is the top of the drawers that can be seen.

Correctamundo. You can clearly see a button from his trousers and another from his drawers.







P.S. Just had this thought: To outsiders we must seem like some strange folk.

[Andrew Kasmar]

Re: corduory overshirt

Hi,

On page 66 of The Boy's War you will see a picture of a 14 year old Confederate killed by bayonet at Fort Mahone. I made a mistake, in my first post I said he was killed at Petersburg.

Andrew Kasmar

4th Missouri Company E

[DougCooper]

Re: corduory overshirt

Hi,

On page 66 of The Boy's War you will see a picture of a 14 year old Confederate killed by bayonet at Fort Mahone. I made a mistake, in my first post I said he was killed at Petersburg.

Andrew Kasmar

4th Missouri Company E

Andrew - Fort Mahone was Petersburg. What supporting evidence does the book site that he was 14 and killed by a bayonet?

[DougCooper]

Re: corduory overshirt

I am pretty sure that this image and shirt was discussed in a previous incarnation of the forum which has since been lost. I believe the consensus then was that the shirt was not manufactured from corduroy, but from a striped fabric. Due to the photographic process of the period, the stripes in the fabric cause an optical illusion that makes it appear as if the fabric has depth when it really does not. I have attached a enlargement of the two tiff documents from the stereo pair that the LOC has posted of this image. I believe in the highlighted sections you can see evidence of a twill weave to the fabric.

BTW the image citation is:

Petersburg, Va. Dead Confederate soldier, in trench beyond a section of chevaux-de-frise].
CREATED/PUBLISHED
1865 April 3.
SUMMARY
Photograph from the main eastern theater of war, the siege of Petersburg, June 1864-April 1865.
NOTES
Enlargement made from right half of stereo pair is filed in LOT 4168.
Reference: Civil War photographs, 1861-1865 / compiled by Hirst D. Milhollen and Donald H. Mugridge, Washington, D.C. : Library of Congress, 1977. No. 0426
Title from Milhollen and Mugridge.
Two plates form left (LC-B811-3183B) and right (LC-B811-3183A) halves of a stereograph pair.
MEDIUM
1 negative (2 plates) : glass, stereograph, wet collodion.
CALL NUMBER
LC-B811- 3183
REPRODUCTION NUMBER
LC-DIG-cwpb-02556 DLC (digital file from original neg. of left half)
LC-DIG-cwpb-02555 DLC (digital file from original neg. of right half)
LC-B8171-3183 DLC (b&w film copy neg.)
SPECIAL TERMS OF USE
No known restrictions on publication.

Well done Brian - agree with your assessment.

[OleMissRebel]

Re: corduory overshirt

Can't really tell how he was killed. 14 does look about right though:

[billmatt04]

Re: corduory overshirt

That poor, poor boy

[OleMissRebel]

Re: corduory overshirt

All deaths from that war are troubling, but to die so near to the end of the war (less than a month in the case of this boy) is particularly heartbreaking.