The Race to Knoxville

[Thomas Alleman]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Are there any first person accounts of either side on this battle? Also is Armstrong hill still there?

[lukegilly13]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

I think i'm going to cheat and drive down a few times and practice climbing the fort...lol...
i'm kidding...It's difficult enough with gear....near impossible with a knapsack pulling at your back.
This will be a sweet event!

[Greg Barnett]

Are there any first person accounts of either side on this battle? Also is Armstrong hill still there?

Thomas,

John Watkins, 19th Ohio Battery, has the most extensive first person account of the Knoxville Campaign. There is a collection of his accounts of the war at the University of Tennessee. http://dlc.lib.utk.edu/f/fa/fulltext/1161.html

Here is a tidbit from the roundtable:

In a September 1863 letter, Corporal John Watkins of the 19th Ohio Battery describes Knoxville to his fiancé, Sarah: "Knoxville must have been quite a place before the war began, but it looks now as though it was the oldest place in the world and been allowed to run down ever since it was built...." He also mentions that Knoxville had contained a Confederate conscript camp where the conscripts had to be confined "in order to hold them."
Writing to a friend in mid-December, he states, "on the 20th [November] there was hardly any firing till dark then the rebels got another battery in position fired 4 or 5 times throwing shell clear over the town and bursting 200 feet high. On the 21st it rained most all day and no fighting. The rebels had got clear round us from the river on the west side of the town to the river on the east side of town." In the same letter the corporal tells of a "sortie" made on November 24th by members of the 2nd Michigan to the Rebel rifle pits in front of the fort. After the 2nd was repulsed, a truce was called to retrieve the wounded, "then you had ought to have seen the rebel brutes rush out of the pits and strip the dead. Oh if I ever felt like taking a mans hearts blood, it was them devils. And right in plain sight to [sic]."
On the night of November 28th, Confederates in front of Fort Sanders drove in the Federal pickets. The Federal artillery in the fort began firing in response and, according to Watkins, fired all night. In the frigid dawn of Sunday morning, November 29th, the expected Confederate assault came as 4,000 of Gen. Lafayette McLaws' veterans stormed up the hill.


"...soon after daylight they opened on us from all their batteries or at least 5 positions and if the shell didn't fly around us I am no judge. The air was full of bursting shell but the most of them to [sic] high. I don't think that there was a man killed in the 3/4 of an hour that they shelled us and but one wounded and he was right beside us in a tent.... I was standing up against the breastwork and saw the shell coming just as plain as day. We could hear them coming before they got anywhere near us and what a noise they make. While this shelling was going on the rebels were forming for a charge on the fort and the first our folks new [sic] of them they were within 20 yards of the picket line and less than 300 from the point of the fort. And on they came with a yell 3 columns deep and one in reserve...the rebels came over logs, wire, and stumps and planted there [sic] colors right on the outer slope of the fort. The slope there is on an angle of 45 degrees and about 20 feet from the top of the work down to the top of the ditch. Then the ditch is about 7 feet wide and 6 deep. They just piled in there on top of one another dead wounded and dying and the living to get away from the fire of our troops. One of them got up to one of the embrasures with some 4 or 5 behind him in front of a piece that has 3 charges of canisters in it, and he ha hawed right out and says surrender you yankee sons of bitches. The words were hardly out of his mouth before the piece was pulled off and away went Mr. Reb and companions blown into ribons [sic]. But all of this did not last more than half an hour for those that were alive in the ditches began to call for quarters and the order was given to cease firing.... There was arrangements made right off to cease hostilities till 7 o'clock in the evening. As soon as the firing stopped I went up and got on the parapet to look at them. And such a sight I never saw before nor do I care about seeing again. The ditch in places was almost full of them piled one on top of the other.... They were brave men. Most of them Georgians. I would give one of the wounded a drink as quick as anybody if I had it. That is about the only thing they ask for when first wounded. But at the same time I wished the whole Southern Confederacy was in that ditch in the same predicament."

After Knoxville, John Watkins served with Sherman through the Atlanta campaign and then served with Thomas at Nashville. At War's end, Watkins returned to Ohio where he married his Sarah. However, in 1895 he was once again in Knoxville for a reunion of the 19th Ohio Battery. Two letters written to Sarah at home give us an interesting insight into his visit.

"We went out to the Armstrong house I spoke about. We were a little doubtful about our receipt... [but we were] escorted into the parlor to sit and rest awhile...showed us every room in the house. Showed us all the bullet-holes and shell marks...showed us where his guns were placed on either side of the house, also where some men were killed on both sides, rebel and Federal and where buried in her yard. We were also on the spot where General Sanders was shot about 80 rods from her house."

And....

"Went to Fort Sanders, looked the place over and talked with old soldiers and some other people about it, but it will soon be of the past -- boys are helping to tear down the parapets to find bullets and they get lots of them.... We can locate the place where our gun stood all right, now there is a big house built within 100 feet of it and a road is graded right through the works between where we were."



As to Armsrong Hill... It is still there. If you look at google maps and type in 892 Carls Lane Knoxville TN 37920 you will be at the south east foot of Armstrong Hill. Click on the "terrain" button and you can easily see the natural formations on the south side of the river. Refer to the period position map of the battle and one can see where the Confederate battery was place on Cherokee Heights, now Cherokee Bluff Circle. Law's Alabama Boys and Robertson's Texas Boys were accross the field from the 23rd Army Corps and Colonel Daniel Cameron's Brigade. Look at this link: http://www.discoveret.org/kcwrt/history/ha-text.htm

One can still walk around in this area, although much of it is private property. The majority of the land where the battle took place is undeveloped. It could possibly be made into a nice preserved battlefield, if anyone in Knoxville actually knew about it:wink_smil

That's all I got to say bout that, right now.

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

I think i'm going to cheat and drive down a few times and practice climbing the fort...lol...
i'm kidding...It's difficult enough with gear....near impossible with a knapsack pulling at your back.
This will be a sweet event!

Luke,
You will have opportunities to practice your climbing skills. Sean and I will announce a few work days soon (probably the first few weeks of March). The benefit of working, will be the fort climbing exercise drill and then of course repairing the damage you do to the scarp!!! We will need some help planting tree stumps, and setting up the telegraph wire, and the abitis. There will be garrisoned troops in the fort to perform much of this duty, but we will have to do some advanced prep work for them.

Also, we have set a deadline for registration fee payment. This will be March 27th. This will give us three weeks time to procure the needed provisions. Exceptions can be made, but these will need to be communicated with Sean and myself. We want as many men as we can register, but we do not want anyone to have a bad experience over poor planning. So please help us out on this.

There is still room in all companies. Please remember that there is a cap on the confederate companies. This is for a historical number ratio. I will form a third confederate company, Co B, if needed. I would love to see this happen. Once one company is filled, registrants will be placed in the next company. You can not go wrong with either commander and you may even make some new pards!!

I will make another announcement later today and post details on the website.

https://www.fortsanders.info

I will also have items for give-away at the sign in. Some may even call them door prizes!!! These will be items that everyone can enjoy, except maybe one's wife.

[suspenderless pard]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Luke,

I talked to Dewey the other night and he claims that it won't be as easy to scale the wall as it was in the fall. I got off the phone when he pulled out the engineering manual and started explaining how. :) Apparantly he has a plan. Look forward to seeing everyone at the event. All I can tell you confederate minded folks is keep your heads down and watch out for the telegraph wire.

Sean Cooper
Capt. Co.A
2nd Michigan

[Thomas Alleman]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

WOW it is still there, and is there any evidence of Fort Higley? This should be preserved, I am amazed it is still undeveloped. It is plain to see with the terrain feature. I think that at least markers should be put up but to develope the site would be awesome. Men who die with such conviction should be remembered. I think if you published the accounts in the local paper, just imagine what people would think. Again it is good to keep relic hunters out, so maybe not. When I get down there I will have to try to visit that area.

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

WOW it is still there, and is there any evidence of Fort Higley? This should be preserved, I am amazed it is still undeveloped. It is plain to see with the terrain feature. I think that at least markers should be put up but to develope the site would be awesome. Men who die with such conviction should be remembered. I think if you published the accounts in the local paper, just imagine what people would think. Again it is good to keep relic hunters out, so maybe not. When I get down there I will have to try to visit that area.

Thomas,
Here is some of the efforts that are going into this area.

http://www.preservationnation.org/magazine/2008/todays-news/foundation-buys-tenn-civil.html

It seems odd, but this property is just across the river from two of the country's largest sporting venues (Neyland Stadium 110,000 capacity and Thompson-Boling Arena 35,000) Most Knoxvillians seem to have not a clue that these forts exist so close to downtown. This is much like the awesome Ft Negely in Nashville.

The website www.fortsanders.info has just been updated with a new announcement!

Cheers

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

The two Confederate companies are about half full and the Federal side is coming along rather well also. Make plans on coming out.

Registration update as of today:


4th Alabama

Capt Brian Hicks,
Commanding
Armory Guards, WIG, Widow's Sons Mess

1st Lt G S Barnett, Adjutant
Armory Guards, WIG, Possum Skinners, New Knoxville Mess



Company C "Magnolia Cadets"

Capt. Jeff Noland
Possum Skinners Mess (25 max)

Madison G Barnett/ New Knoxville Mess
Sean Wilson/ New Knoxville Mess
Wes Verbal/ Mossy Creek Mess
Chris Barnett/ New Knoxville Mess
Tudd Dean/ Iron Gray Mess
Terry Hancock/ AG, Possum Skinners
Reid Prestwood/ Possum Skinners
David Norton/ Possum Skinners
J Caleb Benefield/ Possum Skinners
Steven Middleton/ New Knoxville Mess



Company G "Marion Light Infantry"

Capt. Kiev Thomason
Armory Guards, WIG (30 Max)

Eric Brown/ AG
Chad Wrinn/ Breckinridge Greys, WIG
Jordan Roberts/ AG
Tripp Corbin/ WIG, AG
Brian Chastain/ Breckinridge Greys, WIG
Casey Graber/ Flatlanders Mess
Joseph Gangler/ Flatlanders Mess
Terry Chadwick/ AG
Lewis Robinson/ AG
Herb Coats/ AG, WIG
Nathan Petersburg/ Executioners Mess
Nathan Peterson/ Executioners Mess
Kaelin Vernon/ Dippin Gourd Mess
Luke Gilly/ Breckenbridge Grays
Clint Morris/ AG
Jason Scoggins/ AG
James Wooten/ AG




2d Michigan

Capt Jim Butler,
Commanding
SCAR, SRR





Company A Capt Sean Cooper
Mossy Creek Mess, SRR

Charles Temm/ SCAR,21st OVI
Clint McKissack/ Mossy Creek Mess
Thomas Alleman/ WIG
Sascha McKnight/ SRR,SCAR
Travis Caldwell/ Mossy Creek Mess
Todd Miller/ SRR,SCAR
Steven Brewington/ Moss Creek Mess
Scott Dunn/Mossy Creek Mess
James Cassell/ MCM SCAR
Kevin Edmiston/ MCM SCAR
Ryan Halsey/ MCM SCAR
Bruce MacDonald/ SCAR
Jeremy Ray/ MCM SCAR
Shawn Sturgill MCM SCAR
Brian McGarrahan/ Tramp Brigade Mess
Gary Hurst
Josh Kuchmuk/ MCM

Company G Capt Dave Thomas

Jim Bruce/ Wolftever Creek Mess
Brian Maddox
Travis Herbert/ WIG/GVB
Tony DiMaiolo/ 37th Tenn
Mike McCormick
Jeremy Hicks/ 37th Tenn



Thanks for all of the interest thus far.

[majdoc]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Greg
On those work days, let us know I'll try and make a work day if possible.

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Will do!
Thanks for the offer Doc.

Cheers

[Thomas Alleman]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Less than a mile away, condos and townhouses already cover the site of the Battle of Armstrong's Hill, where Confederate soldiers lost to Union troops in 1863. Developer Dovetail Companies purchased the property in 2006, cleared the land of 40 acres of trees, and built "the Woodlands of Knoxville," which opened last year.

To bad to hear about Armstrong Hill though. Well maybe a plaque or something could be put up. I am wondering if the condo complex, is near the hills, it looks like it is not, there might still hope, anyone on the ground know about this?

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Thomas
The Woodlands are actually closer to Ft Higley. They lay due west of the Fort. Armstrong Hill is closer to the river. The ravine between Cherokee Hgts and Armstrong Hill is undeveloped at present and there has been recent efforts to preserve the properties. The city and private foundations are involved.
I will try to get over that way and get photos and give you some distance perspective.

[hpotter]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

Ft. Higley is a neat little fort. You could see the outline of it on google earth, not sure if you still can. It used to be on private property and the man that owned it wouldn't let anyone on. I guess he's sold it since I was at UT. Even though they call it the battle of Armstrong Hill, the hill didn't get as much action as the valley between it and Cherokee bluffs. The Confederates made it up Armstrong hill just about as much as the Federals counter attacked back up Cherokee Bluff. The Valley is the treasure that I have dreamed about seeing preserved. There is a small run off from the valley into the river and would probably be a flood zone fore a good part of it. It's been a few yrs since I've seen it.

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

I wanted to post pictures of Knoxville and the Forts south of the river.

1) The large panoramic picture is taken from the copula at the University of East Tennessee (now University of Tennessee). This was called Fort Byington at the time and is now referred to as "the Hill" In this photo, you can see (from left to right) Fort Stanley, Fort Dickerson, Fort Higley, Cherokee Heights, and Battery Noble. The photo was taken on March 18, 1864.

2) The second photo is of Fort Stanley looking across the Holston River(now the Tennessee). From left to right: Bridge near the mouth of First Creek, Methodist Hill, Temperance Hill, Fort Huntington Smith, Battery Clifton Lee, Flint Hill, Battery Stearman, Mabry's Hill, and Fort Hill.

3) View from Fort Dickerson. This is looking northwest from the fort. In the photo is a view of Fort Higley and in the distance the bluff near the river is Cherokee Heights. This is where the confederacy had their artillery. On the other side of Ft Higley, near the river is Armstrong Hill. One is unable to see this from the POV.

4) The fourth photo is from looking northwest, but viewing toward downdown. In the photo from the left one can see the barracks (near the river), Battery Noble,the mouth of second creek, Fort Sanders ( in the distance), and Fort Byington (the Hill). One can easily see how open the land between the forts and the river is and difficult it must have been for the confederates to attack.

5) The hill as it appeared after 1840 and before the war.

I hope to get a few modern photos from these vantage points. Stay posted.

One can see how well Knoxville was fortified with all of the forts and batteries.

I will also try to scan a map of Knoxville that Capt O E Poe surveyed during Dec-Feb 1863-1864. This was performed after the battles occurred. This will show one the position of each of these forts and batteries.

Cheers and see you in Knoxville.

[Greg Barnett]

Re: The Race to Knoxville

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